The Politics Thread

[TANGODANCER]

Nobody wants a new leader talking about Brexit. We just need honesty in appraising the mess we are in and what the fixes are.

Shades of Tommy Cooper....Just like that.

[BWFC_Insane]

As usual the Tories have wrecked the economy yet the media prop up the myth that they are supposedly economically competent.
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-62079052.amp

Tory governments spent more, borrow more, deliver less.

Those aren’t opinions either. 12 years and we are far far far worse off than in 2010. Shambles.

[TANGODANCER]

"Nearer and nearer by changing horses, Still so far away". On a Carousel, Hollies 1967.

[Worthy4England]

As usual the Tories have wrecked the economy yet the media prop up the myth that they are supposedly economically competent.
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-62079052.amp

Tory governments spent more, borrow more, deliver less.

Those aren’t opinions either. 12 years and we are far far far worse off than in 2010. Shambles.

Awww, but there's been some problems in the world. They've done better than Corbyn would've done, fact.

The problem I see with Labour at the moment are, Starmer only has limited reach, he's relying on people falling out of love with the Tory's rather than offering things that are going to make them fall out of love with the Tory's. Their messages are far too complex.

[Worthy4England]

Whilst we're on the topic. Surely we're paying Liz Truss (in part) to represent us at the G20 where Russia are in attendance? But no, an election that's not going to take place for at least a couple of weeks is more important. Nothing says fcuk you, it's all about me, than leaving your day job early, to go sniffing round how many mates might support a leadership bid...

[BWFC_Insane]

As usual the Tories have wrecked the economy yet the media prop up the myth that they are supposedly economically competent.
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-62079052.amp

Tory governments spent more, borrow more, deliver less.

Those aren’t opinions either. 12 years and we are far far far worse off than in 2010. Shambles.

Awww, but there's been some problems in the world. They've done better than Corbyn would've done, fact.

The problem I see with Labour at the moment are, Starmer only has limited reach, he's relying on people falling out of love with the Tory's rather than offering things that are going to make them fall out of love with the Tory's. Their messages are far too complex.

Starmer was a great opponent to Johnson but I agree he isn’t going to rip up trees against many of the others as his appeal was the opposite sort of personality to Johnson.

I suppose we are in 2010 territory where I think the Tories have made such a mess of it that people are aware but nobody quite trusts the opposition or believes in them enough to hand them a mandate either. Hence Cameron’s coalition.

As I said yesterday I suspect a fair few hope Keir is fined and Labour can continue the path but with a more dynamic leader…I’m not brimming with suggestions as to who that might be. I’m thinking realistically Lisa Nandy is the best bet.

[Worthy4England]

Well, he ain't been fined!

[nicholaldo]

Well, he ain't been fined!

I bet the Tories are queitly quite relieved about that.

[Worthy4England]

Well, he ain't been fined!

I bet the Tories are queitly quite relieved about that.

I can't help feeling you're correct. Nor that the timing of the announcement is coincidental.

[BWFC_Insane]

Well, he ain't been fined!

I bet the Tories are queitly quite relieved about that.

The Tories aren’t quaking in their boots at Starmer but they would prefer a more destabilising option in charge of Labour.

The fear for many Tories is Starmer has the effect of dragging them back to the centre away from the Brexit populist guff and that splits their party again.

Whereas a less coherent centre left Labour leader someone more from the edges has the opposite effect and splits Labour leaving the Tories free to claim the centre from whereever they choose.

I think bottom line there isn’t a Blair type to propel Labour forward just yet so it’s a choice between imperfect options. The thing to remember is the Tories don’t have a great option either.

[TANGODANCER]

I'm beginning to understand why Screaming Lord Such decided to go into politics.

[Worthy4England]

Are you suggesting we all just ignore politics, Tango? That's fine for folks to do, but seems a little unlikely on "The Politics Thread"

[TANGODANCER]

Are you suggesting we all just ignore politics, Tango? That's fine for folks to do, but seems a little unlikely on "The Politics Thread"

I was actually meaning he possibly didn't see much competition so thought he'd have a go, mate..

[Worthy4England]

Are you suggesting we all just ignore politics, Tango? That's fine for folks to do, but seems a little unlikely on "The Politics Thread"

I was actually meaning he possibly didn't see much competition so thought he'd have a go, mate..

Ahh, I see. Ta. Mind he didn't win any, in 46 attempts.

[BWFC_Insane]

Sunak is launching himself as the serious candidate for serious times. Good. Talks about fiscal responsibility which is obvious given the lack of any for twelve years. But for me he needs to explain what that means in reality. Austerity failed. It left our economy weaker and slower than the rest of the developed world. So how specifically can we marry fiscal responsibility to the horrendous cost of living crisis where it’s obviously we need to spend increasing amounts or face poverty on a scale never seen before and also fix our broken public services and nhs that are in their worst positions since the 50’s.

The answer has to be some fairly heft progressive tax system. There aren’t any magic beans. We just paid £7.9Bn interest in a month on public borrowing. A record for the month in history. So I mean bland ‘grow the economy’ that Johnson tried to rely on won’t cut it.

We do need to be bold and grow the economy. There is a big opportunity to do so if we invest massively in green economy and focus on job creation to solve the climate crisis. But the second part has to be much higher tax levels at higher earners and tax on second homes and landlords. Protect industry and business. But we cannot in the current circumstances allow wealth hoarding or ignore the reality that economic inequality continues to grow as the poorest are now becoming substantially poorer whilst the wealthy 5% grow their incomes without productivity year on year.

Austerity and cuts failed. The world accepted they failed. So we need to focus on growth and progressive taxation. But will sunak be bold enough?

[Prufrock]

I'm far less relieved about Sunak than others. I mean he's not a lying shithouse so in that sense he'd be an improvement, but you're not going to get any of that ^^^. He's an austerity man, and was constantly clashing with number 10 on having to spend money on e.g. furlough.

He doesn't have much in his favour for me beyond not being manifestly unsuitable to be PM on account of his character alone. Would still be baaaad.

[BWFC_Insane]

I'm far less relieved about Sunak than others. I mean he's not a lying shithouse so in that sense he'd be an improvement, but you're not going to get any of that ^^^. He's an austerity man, and was constantly clashing with number 10 on having to spend money on e.g. furlough.

He doesn't have much in his favour for me beyond not being manifestly unsuitable to be PM on account of his character alone. Would still be baaaad.

Not sure I disagree and I guess that what I’m edging to.

Unless someone is prepared to be honest about the challenges ahead then it’s going to be tough going. And being honest and having workable solutions are another thing.

However he’d be a huge improvement. Would he be Cameron bad? Yep. That’s how bad it’s got that we’d have to take that small crumb.

[nicholaldo]

I can't see it being Sunak for the simple fact he's trying too hard.

[BWFC_Insane]

I can't see it being Sunak for the simple fact he's trying too hard.

And the Tory membership is full of angry gammon.

[Worthy4England]

How we squaring prudent and progressive tax and a non-dom loaded wife?