The Politics Thread

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Who will you be voting for?

Labour
12
40%
Conservatives
11
37%
Liberal Democrats
2
7%
UK Independence Party (UKIP)
0
No votes
Green Party
3
10%
Plaid Cymru
0
No votes
Other
1
3%
Planet Hobo
1
3%
 
Total votes: 30

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Abdoulaye's Twin
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Abdoulaye's Twin » Mon Apr 17, 2017 8:49 am

Hoboh wrote:
Mon Apr 17, 2017 8:06 am
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... own-jewels

I think the time to start playing hard ball with the EU is fast approaching.
Of course the European Medicines Agency is going to move. Would you have us put the Bank of England or some other British institution in Frankfurt? You're also underestimating what a loss the EMA will be to the UK and the impact will be significant. It'll take a large chunk out of that £350m a week once you take into account the knock on effect of the jobs, ancillary jobs and additional costs to the MHRA and the industry as a whole. I suspect a chunk of Cambridge will follow to whichever country gets it.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Worthy4England » Mon Apr 17, 2017 9:14 am

Hoboh wrote:
Mon Apr 17, 2017 8:06 am
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... own-jewels

I think the time to start playing hard ball with the EU is fast approaching.
Absolutely. Let us show Johnny Foreigner, we are not to be trifled with.

What do you suggest first?

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Lord Kangana » Mon Apr 17, 2017 9:50 am

They don't like it up 'em Dr Beeching!

Or something.

In all seriousness though, I think once we revert to blue passports, they'll realise there's nowhere for them to hide and cave-in to all our demands.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Prufrock » Mon Apr 17, 2017 12:13 pm

:laugh:
Hoboh wrote:
Mon Apr 17, 2017 8:06 am
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... own-jewels

I think the time to start playing hard ball with the EU is fast approaching.
In a world that has decided
That it's going to lose its mind
Be more kind, my friends, try to be more kind.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Hoboh » Mon Apr 17, 2017 4:49 pm

Prufrock wrote:
Mon Apr 17, 2017 12:13 pm
:laugh:
Hoboh wrote:
Mon Apr 17, 2017 8:06 am
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... own-jewels

I think the time to start playing hard ball with the EU is fast approaching.

Okay smarty pants you'll see some folk in the EU are going to push things too far just watch them squeal when security is on the table.

Think some of them would like a statement that the UK would only use its Nuke deterrent only if the UK its self is threatened?

Think some of the smart ass countries who get first hand security information from the UK would like that curtailing?

Should be great fun watching some of them squirm once Turkey's new leader for life starts his blackmail with migrants and the Royal navy keep well out of it, in fact we really should consider just how much deployment we do in respect of NATO.

Play hardball and don't squeal when we kick back.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Abdoulaye's Twin » Mon Apr 17, 2017 4:59 pm

NATO

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Lord Kangana » Mon Apr 17, 2017 6:12 pm

It'd be stupid, scratch that, inconceivable and pointless of of us to only use our Nuclear deterrent to defend our small island.

I suspect the EU are well aware of that. What with Nuclear fallout not being a great respecter of national borders. And heaven forbid the refugees it would produce coming over here to steal from our food banks.

I'm just hoping there's enough adults in the room when it comes up for discussion. But seeing as we have the hapless trio of Johnson, Davies and Fox, the cards aren't really stacked in our favour.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Hoboh » Mon Apr 17, 2017 6:19 pm

Abdoulaye's Twin wrote:
Mon Apr 17, 2017 4:59 pm
NATO

So lets say, hypothetically Putin or some Russian leader nuked Berlin or some other European city, the loss of US lives was minimal, do you really, honestly, think the US would risk mass destruction in a tit for tat exchange NATO or no NATO?

This is why China will not intervene if Korea goes the nuclear way.

Why should the EU live under our nuclear blanket? They don't bloody contribute anything to it or maybe we could introduce a charge?

I suspect France won't be too keen to jump on the band waggon either unless it is targeted directly. Just as an aside there are murmurings from a couple of the French presidential candidates about continuing NATO membership and I doubt after the amount of time it took them to join in the first place they would just hop into bed with an EU army.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Hoboh » Mon Apr 17, 2017 6:21 pm

Lord Kangana wrote:
Mon Apr 17, 2017 6:12 pm
It'd be stupid, scratch that, inconceivable and pointless of of us to only use our Nuclear deterrent to defend our small island.

I suspect the EU are well aware of that. What with Nuclear fallout not being a great respecter of national borders. And heaven forbid the refugees it would produce coming over here to steal from our food banks.

I'm just hoping there's enough adults in the room when it comes up for discussion. But seeing as we have the hapless trio of Johnson, Davies and Fox, the cards aren't really stacked in our favour.

You mean it just does not 'fit' with your bent over trousers round ankles waving a tube of EU Vaseline?

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Hoboh » Mon Apr 17, 2017 6:27 pm

Hoboh wrote:
Mon Apr 17, 2017 6:21 pm
Lord Kangana wrote:
Mon Apr 17, 2017 6:12 pm
It'd be stupid, scratch that, inconceivable and pointless of of us to only use our Nuclear deterrent to defend our small island.

I suspect the EU are well aware of that. What with Nuclear fallout not being a great respecter of national borders. And heaven forbid the refugees it would produce coming over here to steal from our food banks.

I'm just hoping there's enough adults in the room when it comes up for discussion. But seeing as we have the hapless trio of Johnson, Davies and Fox, the cards aren't really stacked in our favour.

You mean it just does not 'fit' with your bent over trousers round ankles waving a tube of EU Vaseline?

Oh and fallout? funny people live in the cities that the Yanks nuked, life and even people live near Chernobyl, Japan hardly has mass no go areas near its nuke disaster, in a lab it might be 10,000 years contamination in the outside it seems different, not saying there are no effects, there are but you do wonder about this end of world business sometimes.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Lord Kangana » Mon Apr 17, 2017 6:56 pm

Trust me, when it comes to it you're going to be hoping they brought the Vaseline.
You can judge the whole world on the sparkle that you think it lacks.
Yes, you can stare into the abyss, but it's staring right back.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Abdoulaye's Twin » Mon Apr 17, 2017 8:06 pm

You do understand what Nato actually is right? I mean, I know Donald had to ask but I didn't have you down as that thick :shock:

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Worthy4England » Mon Apr 17, 2017 8:14 pm

Hoboh wrote:
Mon Apr 17, 2017 6:19 pm
Abdoulaye's Twin wrote:
Mon Apr 17, 2017 4:59 pm
NATO

So lets say, hypothetically Putin or some Russian leader nuked Berlin or some other European city, the loss of US lives was minimal, do you really, honestly, think the US would risk mass destruction in a tit for tat exchange NATO or no NATO?

This is why China will not intervene if Korea goes the nuclear way.

Why should the EU live under our nuclear blanket? They don't bloody contribute anything to it or maybe we could introduce a charge?

I suspect France won't be too keen to jump on the band waggon either unless it is targeted directly. Just as an aside there are murmurings from a couple of the French presidential candidates about continuing NATO membership and I doubt after the amount of time it took them to join in the first place they would just hop into bed with an EU army.
There are more warheads in Europe between NATO and France, than the UK possesses. They're living under their own blanket.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Hoboh » Mon Apr 17, 2017 10:07 pm

Worthy4England wrote:
Mon Apr 17, 2017 8:14 pm
Hoboh wrote:
Mon Apr 17, 2017 6:19 pm
Abdoulaye's Twin wrote:
Mon Apr 17, 2017 4:59 pm
NATO

So lets say, hypothetically Putin or some Russian leader nuked Berlin or some other European city, the loss of US lives was minimal, do you really, honestly, think the US would risk mass destruction in a tit for tat exchange NATO or no NATO?

This is why China will not intervene if Korea goes the nuclear way.

Why should the EU live under our nuclear blanket? They don't bloody contribute anything to it or maybe we could introduce a charge?

I suspect France won't be too keen to jump on the band waggon either unless it is targeted directly. Just as an aside there are murmurings from a couple of the French presidential candidates about continuing NATO membership and I doubt after the amount of time it took them to join in the first place they would just hop into bed with an EU army.
There are more warheads in Europe between NATO and France, than the UK possesses. They're living under their own blanket.
And to whom do they belong and who controls them? Yep the US and again do you seriously think the US will press the self destruct button because someone else 'got it'?
Just as a matter of interest do you not think that the Russians know exactly where these war heads are as well, those on subs they don't.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Worthy4England » Mon Apr 17, 2017 10:15 pm

France has double our current arsenal. None of it is land based...

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Hoboh » Mon Apr 17, 2017 10:16 pm

Abdoulaye's Twin wrote:
Mon Apr 17, 2017 8:06 pm
You do understand what Nato actually is right? I mean, I know Donald had to ask but I didn't have you down as that thick :shock:

Of course I know what NATO is and it would probably be used in a conventional attack to repel invasion of Europe, what we are talking about is a nuclear strike in which certain countries perhaps would not be out to commit suicide if not directly attacked.

Invading Russia is a big no, no considering their military doctrine if the motherland is invaded is to use nukes.

What I'm saying is maybe we should stop being the first to deploy to the Baltic states, Poland etc. with the Yanks, let some other bugger take up that place and pay for it.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Hoboh » Mon Apr 17, 2017 10:24 pm

Worthy4England wrote:
Mon Apr 17, 2017 10:15 pm
France has double our current arsenal. None of it is land based...
French law requires at least one out of four nuclear submarines to be on patrol in the Atlantic Ocean at any given time, like the UK's policy.
In 2006, French President Jacques Chirac noted that France would be willing to use nuclear weapons against a state attacking France by terrorism. He noted that the French nuclear forces had been configured for this option.
On 21 March 2008, President Nicolas Sarkozy announced that France will reduce its aircraft deliverable nuclear weapon stockpile (which currently consists of 60 TN 81 warheads) by a third (20 warheads) and bring the total French nuclear arsenal to fewer than 300 warhead
:roll: I suppose aircraft deliverable warheads are floating around in space then!
The UK retains a stockpile of 215 thermonuclear warheads, of which 120 are operational as of 2016, but has refused to declare the exact size of its arsenal. Since 1998, the Trident nuclear programme has been the only operational nuclear weapons system in British service. The delivery system consists of four Vanguard class submarines based at HMNB Clyde in Scotland. Each submarine is armed with up to 16 Trident II missiles, each carrying warheads in up to eight MIRV re-entry vehicles. With at least one submarine always on patrol, the Vanguards perform a strategic deterrence role and are also believed to have a sub-strategic capability. In contrast with the other permanent members of the United Nations Security Council, the United Kingdom operates only a submarine-based delivery system, having decommissioned its tactical WE.177 free-fall bombs in 1998.
Double?

I always had you down for being good with numbers. :wink:

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Prufrock » Tue Apr 18, 2017 12:40 am

We can't fire ours without the Americans' say-so.

Either way, once the next nuke is used in anger we're all fuxked. Good job Kim's only got painted egg-boxes.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Abdoulaye's Twin » Tue Apr 18, 2017 5:24 am

NATO's official text wrote:
Mon Apr 17, 2017 10:16 pm
The Parties agree that an armed attack against one or more of them in Europe or North America shall be considered an attack against them all .
It isn't a great leap from there that all hell would break loose if another member in the EU were to be attacked. I would hope it wouldn't go nuclear, but with a few authoritarian dick heads on the loose it's difficult not to fear it becoming a reality.

Take Donald "not getting involved in that shit" and within a couple of months is dropping biggest non-nuclear bombs on Afghanistan, ballistic missiles at Syria and is waving his willy at North Korea. The guy thinks he's Dirty Harry and his ego is such that he might not be able to resist becoming the guy that blew the world up.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Bruce Rioja » Tue Apr 18, 2017 11:10 am

Well, I wasn't expecting that! :shock:
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