Today I'm happy about......

[thebish]

Pack it in you two. We all know where this is headed, so just skip to the making up part

it's an amicable and perfectly polite conversation on a happy thread! nobody needs to make up - nobody has fallen out! chill!

[Abdoulaye's Twin]

Pack it in you two. We all know where this is headed, so just skip to the making up part

it's an amicable and perfectly polite conversation on a happy thread! nobody needs to make up - nobody has fallen out! chill!

We all know that you're both a few posts away from it...you've got form you two

[thebish]

Pack it in you two. We all know where this is headed, so just skip to the making up part

it's an amicable and perfectly polite conversation on a happy thread! nobody needs to make up - nobody has fallen out! chill!

We all know that you're both a few posts away from it...you've got form you two

nahh - nobody was talking conflict until you rocked up! bog off with your internet stirring!

[TANGODANCER]

Since thebish has carefully explained it all, I'll retire. Not that I agree with a word of it, but hey....he thinks I won't troll through the Bible looking to prove him wrong and....well, he's right, I won't.

[Worthy4England]

So you believe love and the like exists - you can't see it...It's not consistent.

I can't see gravity.

This is a bizarre line of argument, I must say!

To try to answer what I think you're getting at: There is plenty of evidence that love exists (are you suggesting it doesn't?). It's an emotion, emotions exist. No-one argues otherwise. If they did, then it's evidence that people claim to feel it (anecdotal evidence isn't the strongest, but it's not "not evidence" either), their heart rate may increase when they see their loved one etc... In that sense no-one would deny that god "exists". People believe in god, can be emotionally moved by the idea of god.

There's then a jump to start making "truth claims" about god having some kind of agency and existing as an entity. That god is an agent that, say, created heaven and earth 3,500 years ago. Well, no, I'm sorry, there's no evidence for that. In the same way that love exists, but Climie Fisher are going to have to provide some bloody evidence before I believe that it's changed anything !

Humanists aren't some caricatures of Richard Dawkins public persona. If I feel like a cup of tea I don't interrogate myself as to whether there is any real evidence that I need a cup of tea. But if someone makes a "truth claim". X happened, because Y called it, then if there's any kind of dispute over that, I believe the best way to settle that is to test the evidential basis for each claim.

That's the point I was making - I'm not suggesting that love doesn't exist but I could only measure certain effects (none of which are love) to show that love exists...If I take the literality of what humanism says, then that shouldn't be good enough. But they seem to apply a different level of rigour to how you'd measure god exists rather than whether love exists, because their main beef seems to be against organised religions. As it happens, I believe love exists, I also believe faith exists and for some folks god exists. I don't believe there was a bloke with a big white beard (except at Christmas - he clearly exists as evidenced by presents and half eaten mince pies).

[thebish]

Since thebish has carefully explained it all, I'll retire.

see, AT?? nothing to see here!

[Abdoulaye's Twin]

Pack it in you two. We all know where this is headed, so just skip to the making up part

it's an amicable and perfectly polite conversation on a happy thread! nobody needs to make up - nobody has fallen out! chill!

We all know that you're both a few posts away from it...you've got form you two

nahh - nobody was talking conflict until you rocked up! bog off with your internet stirring!

I was going to suggest counselling

[Prufrock]

So you believe love and the like exists - you can't see it...It's not consistent.

I can't see gravity.

This is a bizarre line of argument, I must say!

To try to answer what I think you're getting at: There is plenty of evidence that love exists (are you suggesting it doesn't?). It's an emotion, emotions exist. No-one argues otherwise. If they did, then it's evidence that people claim to feel it (anecdotal evidence isn't the strongest, but it's not "not evidence" either), their heart rate may increase when they see their loved one etc... In that sense no-one would deny that god "exists". People believe in god, can be emotionally moved by the idea of god.

There's then a jump to start making "truth claims" about god having some kind of agency and existing as an entity. That god is an agent that, say, created heaven and earth 3,500 years ago. Well, no, I'm sorry, there's no evidence for that. In the same way that love exists, but Climie Fisher are going to have to provide some bloody evidence before I believe that it's changed anything !

Humanists aren't some caricatures of Richard Dawkins public persona. If I feel like a cup of tea I don't interrogate myself as to whether there is any real evidence that I need a cup of tea. But if someone makes a "truth claim". X happened, because Y called it, then if there's any kind of dispute over that, I believe the best way to settle that is to test the evidential basis for each claim.

That's the point I was making - I'm not suggesting that love doesn't exist but I could only measure certain effects (none of which are love) to show that love exists...If I take the literality of what humanism says, then that shouldn't be good enough. But they seem to apply a different level of rigour to how you'd measure god exists rather than whether love exists, because their main beef seems to be against organised religions. As it happens, I believe love exists, I also believe faith exists and for some folks god exists. I don't believe there was a bloke with a big white beard (except at Christmas - he clearly exists as evidenced by presents and half eaten mince pies).

I don't think you understand what humanism says!

You can only measure gravity by its effects. Nobody can give me a bag of gravity and say, " there you go, we've stuck it undera microscope and that's gravity all right ". I don't dispute gravity exists.

A humanist would never say you can't prove God exists only by showing certain effects. No-one is saying that because you can't produce direct physical evidence of God, it's impossible to show God exists or is likely to exist. I'd absolutely accept that you could prove god exists (or to keep Nietzsche happy, at least existed ) by showing god must have created the earth, or man. The problem isn't the type of evidence, it's the lack of it. I'm saying you can't show god must have created the earth or man. You can't show those effects.

[Worthy4England]

But neither can science show that something called a Higgs-Boson did it. Yet you have a preference for that belief...without trying to understand where a Higgs-Boson came from...

[thebish]

I don't think you understand what humanism says!

talking of which... any progress on my questions?

[TANGODANCER]

By the way, Mr Darcy never did get his breeches wet in a lake, gaze fondly at Elizabeth Bennet from his bathroom window, go to fencing classes, have a spotted great dane or gallop gaily across a meadow to view Netherfield, but you try telling a couple of million women that.

[Salford Trotter]

Today my son was appointed to his first international game as the Asst Referee on England U15s v Turkey U15s at St George's Park later this month....chuffed to bits for him

[thebish]

Today my son was appointed to his first international game as the Asst Referee on England U15s v Turkey U15s at St George's Park later this month....chuffed to bits for him

wahayyy - that's fantastic! well done to the lad!

[Worthy4England]

Boss: Do you fancy a week away at a conference in Cannes?

Me: GGGGGGGGGGGGOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL

[thebish]

this..

[Harry Genshaw]

Boss: Do you fancy a week away at a conference in Cannes?

Me: GGGGGGGGGGGGOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL

Woooahh! You wont have to miss the Brentford game will you?

[TANGODANCER]

Opened the door today to find my brother visiting. Not seen him for a while as he now lives Lythham/Poulton way. He's fit and well and we spent a pleasant afternoon catching up with things past and present. Nice surprise.

[Worthy4England]

Boss: Do you fancy a week away at a conference in Cannes?

Me: GGGGGGGGGGGGOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL

Woooahh! You wont have to miss the Brentford game will you?

No games on whilst I'm there...can't have everything I suppose.

Still whilst on the happy thread, one more day and break up for Christmas.....

[Enoch]

break up for Christmas.....

[clapton is god]

break up for Christmas.....

Well done!

I'm waiting until the 21st but have told my work provider I'm closed for three weeks after that, something I've never done before.