The Politics Thread

[boltonboris]

Yes whilst in the EU we've had slowing economic conditions. We've also had a speeding up economy over various cycles and IIRC in the 1980's a number of "economic miracles"...

No different than any other economy in or out of the EU?

Cool, so what's everyone worried about then?!

[Worthy4England]

Yes whilst in the EU we've had slowing economic conditions. We've also had a speeding up economy over various cycles and IIRC in the 1980's a number of "economic miracles"...

No different than any other economy in or out of the EU?

Cool, so what's everyone worried about then?!

There was no need to change...All economies pick up and slow down, we currently have free trade and passporting rights. No one can yet tell us what that's going to look like post exit.

The question is the same now as it was before the referendum.

What will our trade position look like post exit.

What are you going to get immigration down to

When will the NHS get it's £350m a week...

Not worried about it, just want to know some of the things that every fcuker refused to answer pre-referendum.

[Montreal Wanderer]

Yes whilst in the EU we've had slowing economic conditions. We've also had a speeding up economy over various cycles and IIRC in the 1980's a number of "economic miracles"...

No different than any other economy in or out of the EU?

Cool, so what's everyone worried about then?!

There was no need to change...All economies pick up and slow down, we currently have free trade and passporting rights. No one can yet tell us what that's going to look like post exit.

The question is the same now as it was before the referendum.

What will our trade position look like post exit.

What are you going to get immigration down to

When will the NHS get it's £350m a week...

Not worried about it, just want to know some of the things that every fcuker refused to answer pre-referendum.

Not sure about the others but I have a pretty shrewd idea of the answer to the NHS question.

[Worthy4England]

Me too. They shouldn't be allowed to get away with it, though.

[Montreal Wanderer]

Me too. They shouldn't be allowed to get away with it, though.

Hold politicians accountable? Novel notion!

[boltonboris]

Speaking of holding politicians accountable.. Obama's $400m 'ransom' payment to Iran has apparently broken all kinds of laws..

"we do not negotiate with terrorists....

.... We just give them whatever they ask for"

[Hoboh]

Speaking of holding politicians accountable.. Obama's $400m 'ransom' payment to Iran has apparently broken all kinds of laws..

"we do not negotiate with terrorists....

.... We just give them whatever they ask for"

Let's be fair here Boris, the Russians have probably fleeced the Yanks for billions over the years seeing they really have not a clue who the hell they are giving cash support to.

[Worthy4England]

Why do we care what Obama spends US money on particularly? He's not accountable to me as part of the UK electorate.

[Bijou Bob]

The Tories must have had a series of congratulatory dinner parties tonight, after the courts effectively sentenced the Labour Party to an eternity in opposition. It's a political tragedy and one that worries me. Corbyn now appears to be a helpless puppet being manipulated by McDonnell and others, but his tacit acceptance of violence, bullying and racism points towards the possibility of some civil unrest in the months to come, from supporters who may well feel that victory gives them carte blanche to up the ante.

[Hoboh]

The Tories must have had a series of congratulatory dinner parties tonight, after the courts effectively sentenced the Labour Party to an eternity in opposition. It's a political tragedy and one that worries me. Corbyn now appears to be a helpless puppet being manipulated by McDonnell and others, but his tacit acceptance of violence, bullying and racism points towards the possibility of some civil unrest in the months to come, from supporters who may well feel that victory gives them carte blanche to up the ante.

Sensible thoughts, I expect the black clad, mask wearing, brick throwing, socialist ninja's to be out in force at a riot near you soon, just shoot the fcukers!

[bobo the clown]

The Tories must have had a series of congratulatory dinner parties tonight, after the courts effectively sentenced the Labour Party to an eternity in opposition. It's a political tragedy and one that worries me. Corbyn now appears to be a helpless puppet being manipulated by McDonnell and others, but his tacit acceptance of violence, bullying and racism points towards the possibility of some civil unrest in the months to come, from supporters who may well feel that victory gives them carte blanche to up the ante.

Sensible thoughts, I expect the black clad, mask wearing, brick throwing, socialist ninja's to be out in force at a riot near you soon, just shoot the fcukers!

Totally.

But bw careful saying this as you'll be ridiculed.

Maybe just wait & watch.

Direct action ... but will people like it ?

Anyway. It paves the way for a return of Grammar Schools. So can't be all bad. Thank you Jezza

[Worthy4England]

Clearly not the only party to have bullies in their ranks, as the case of Elliot Johnson will attest to, and making a bloke who has multiple counts of racism, Foreign Secretary (picanninies anyone?) is hardly helping stamp down on it. There's Bolton's very own Bob Allen, who thinks it's ok to post pictures of gorillas alongside those of Asian councillors. Letwin's views on black people are fairly well chronicled and they seemed to be fairly accepting of branding the new Mayor of London an Islamic terrorist.

Maybe it's time to clamp down on both sides, rather than rewarding racism with honours and cabinet posts.

[Hoboh]

Clearly not the only party to have bullies in their ranks, as the case of Elliot Johnson will attest to, and making a bloke who has multiple counts of racism, Foreign Secretary (picanninies anyone?) is hardly helping stamp down on it. There's Bolton's very own Bob Allen, who thinks it's ok to post pictures of gorillas alongside those of Asian councillors. Letwin's views on black people are fairly well chronicled and they seemed to be fairly accepting of branding the new Mayor of London an Islamic terrorist.

Maybe it's time to clamp down on both sides, rather than rewarding racism with honours and cabinet posts.

Your not wrong there mate, I think of Bruce's Polish workmate and the abuse they went through, totally wrong.
Funnily enough we have a Polish family moved in recently near us, don't know them that well past nodding acquaintance but they seem fine, but then again, why should they be anything different.

[Bijou Bob]

Clearly not the only party to have bullies in their ranks, as the case of Elliot Johnson will attest to, and making a bloke who has multiple counts of racism, Foreign Secretary (picanninies anyone?) is hardly helping stamp down on it. There's Bolton's very own Bob Allen, who thinks it's ok to post pictures of gorillas alongside those of Asian councillors. Letwin's views on black people are fairly well chronicled and they seemed to be fairly accepting of branding the new Mayor of London an Islamic terrorist.

Maybe it's time to clamp down on both sides, rather than rewarding racism with honours and cabinet posts.

I'm not sure what your point is here Worthy. I'm not trying to say that only the Labour party under Jezza have issues. Clearly that's not the case. What concerns me is the tightening grip that a far left reactionary mob have on our party in opposition, at a time when we need scrutiny of government decisions. I fear their reaction, not discouraged by their leaders, will be civil unrest.

Watching Momentum at the moment is incredibly similar to watching a 6th form political debate - full of naive bravado with little link to the realities in life.

[Hoboh]

Clearly not the only party to have bullies in their ranks, as the case of Elliot Johnson will attest to, and making a bloke who has multiple counts of racism, Foreign Secretary (picanninies anyone?) is hardly helping stamp down on it. There's Bolton's very own Bob Allen, who thinks it's ok to post pictures of gorillas alongside those of Asian councillors. Letwin's views on black people are fairly well chronicled and they seemed to be fairly accepting of branding the new Mayor of London an Islamic terrorist.

Maybe it's time to clamp down on both sides, rather than rewarding racism with honours and cabinet posts.

I'm not sure what your point is here Worthy. I'm not trying to say that only the Labour party under Jezza have issues. Clearly that's not the case. What concerns me is the tightening grip that a far left reactionary mob have on our party in opposition, at a time when we need scrutiny of government decisions. I fear their reaction, not discouraged by their leaders, will be civil unrest.

Watching Momentum at the moment is incredibly similar to watching a 6th form political debate - full of naive bravado with little link to the realities in life.

I'm pleased you have seen that too.

[Worthy4England]

Clearly not the only party to have bullies in their ranks, as the case of Elliot Johnson will attest to, and making a bloke who has multiple counts of racism, Foreign Secretary (picanninies anyone?) is hardly helping stamp down on it. There's Bolton's very own Bob Allen, who thinks it's ok to post pictures of gorillas alongside those of Asian councillors. Letwin's views on black people are fairly well chronicled and they seemed to be fairly accepting of branding the new Mayor of London an Islamic terrorist.

Maybe it's time to clamp down on both sides, rather than rewarding racism with honours and cabinet posts.

I'm not sure what your point is here Worthy. I'm not trying to say that only the Labour party under Jezza have issues. Clearly that's not the case. What concerns me is the tightening grip that a far left reactionary mob have on our party in opposition, at a time when we need scrutiny of government decisions. I fear their reaction, not discouraged by their leaders, will be civil unrest.

Watching Momentum at the moment is incredibly similar to watching a 6th form political debate - full of naive bravado with little link to the realities in life.

Groups like Momentum are reliant on being able to convince generally fairly moderate people that they're being seriously hard done by. They often have difficulty doing that when people don't believe them. In themselves they're a pretty small group compared to the working population. I was a TU Branch Sec in the 80's in a moderate TU (It was called a Staff Federation rather than a TU). We had a mixed membership from a varied political background. When any strike action was called, it was really difficult to get people to strike if they didn't feel really hard done by (outside of a fairly small number of rather strike than work types).

The point I'm heading towards is that Momentum's chances of "success" are much more closely linked to Government policy than opposition leadership to get mass support.

[Bijou Bob]

I don't disagree Worthy and in the utopian, socialist world of Momentum, this would indeed come to pass. Unfortunately, the real world has the Daily Heil and the Murdoch press, not to mention global financial interests at play, so their chances of influencing anything are slim to nil.

Frankly, I suspect Theresa May could re-introduce internment, turn the Isle of White into our own off shore prison (According to the head of Ofsted, it's nearly there in any case) and privatise every single public institution we have, without much serious opposition. The only hope, the ONLY hope, I suspect, is a split in the Labour party and the formation of a new centre left coalition that's not led by Little Timmy Farron.

[Worthy4England]

Agree with that last bit. The reality is that the Tory govts of the 80's/90's and Lab in the 00's couldn't really be touched by opposition as their majorities were so big. They generally had to rely on their leadership devising policies so out of kilter with the electorate that their back benches rebelled.

I think we're in for an interesting couple of years with Brexit as Tory's are only a small majority and regardless of Labour leadership, there's no denying they like beating a government vote. I can conceive that they might want to give Corbyn a bloody nose rather than May, at the moment.

In between all the Brexit stuff, the current government has been walking back from policy positions on a fairly regular basis.

[Harry Genshaw]

Is it not possible that there's large swathes of the population that quite like Jeremy and the direction he's taking Labour in and he'll be swept into power at the next election?

[Worthy4England]

Is it not possible that there's large swathes of the population that quite like Jeremy and the direction he's taking Labour in and he'll be swept into power at the next election?

Yes. That's possible. Dunno how close you were to Foot or Kinnock under their Leadership, but 1992, Labour had pretty much everything going for it. Problem was trying to get a generally moderate right wing electorate to swing as far left as Kinnock. I was at "that rally" in Sheffield when he melted down into his "We're alright" speech and sat there thinking "Oh fcuk". I think Labour could only win with a fcuk up of epic proportions, continuing austerity biting and a move to centre. I really don't see a scenario that Corbyn wins in. Maybe I'll be shown the error of my ways.