Today I'm angry about.....

[Gary the Enfield]

Is it fair to say that those defending teachers here have some close relative working in education?

Or have benefitted from it?

[jaffka]

I'm backing dan on this one.

I'm sure everyone will now be forced to re-think their initial assessment in the light of your backing!

[jaffka]

Is it fair to say that those defending teachers here have some close relative working in education?

Or have benefitted from it?

You have a close relative as disclosed a few posts ago, should I quote it for you?

I thought it was a fair question really.

[Hoboh]

I'm backing dan on this one.

I'm sure everyone will now be forced to re-think their initial assessment in the light of your backing!

Really think I give a f*ck what anyone thinks? Dan's right and the EU stinks, 10 years and you will all beg to be forgiven.

[Gary the Enfield]

Is it fair to say that those defending teachers here have some close relative working in education?

Or have benefitted from it?

You have a close relative as disclosed a few posts ago, should I quote it for you?

I thought it was a fair question really.

And I was extending the demographic. It's not mutually exclusive is it? Do you NOT think you've benefitted from being educated?

[jaffka]

That's nothing to do with what I was asking.

[Gary the Enfield]

That's nothing to do with what I was asking.

I thought it was a fair question really.

[Lost Leopard Spot]

Yes those of us defending edoocashion all have a vested interest in it, it would seem that Nepotism rules.
Personally I'd love to see these magic schools where people are forcibly drafted from the army, business and banking sectors to run schools that never shut and where holidays are unheard of - for the draftees of course, the pupils will be able to decide for themselves on some kind of free enterprise system which teacher is giving them more of a real world perspective for their hard earned parental spondulicks. Maybe we could instigate lining up the ten percent of the year's worst teachers and having Ofsted come round and shoot them too.

[CrazyHorse]

Blimey.
It's the angry thread. Within the rules of the thread Dan is allowed to be as angry and irrational as he likes. And he doesn't have to justify his opinion to anyone either.

[Hoboh]

Yes those of us defending edoocashion all have a vested interest in it, it would seem that Nepotism rules.
Personally I'd love to see these magic schools where people are forcibly drafted from the army, business and banking sectors to run schools that never shut and where holidays are unheard of - for the draftees of course, the pupils will be able to decide for themselves on some kind of free enterprise system which teacher is giving them more of a real world perspective for their hard earned parental spondulicks. Maybe we could instigate lining up the ten percent of the year's worst teachers and having Ofsted come round and shoot them too.

I'd go with the last sentence

[Bruce Rioja]

I passed my English GCSE(C)

Do they just put them in a paper towel dispenser so that people can simply help themselves to one now? 4Ucking hell fire.

[jaffka]

That's nothing to do with what I was asking.

I thought it was a fair question really.

Well this conversation is only going one way.

If the subject is difficult for you due to having a close relative involved, I can understand, to an extent, your reluctance and inability to discuss this sensibly.

[Hoboh]

Blimey.
It's the angry thread. Within the rules of the thread Dan is allowed to be as angry and irrational as he likes. And he doesn't have to justify his opinion to anyone either.

Who asked you?

[Hoboh]

I passed my English GCSE(C)

Do they just put them in a paper towel dispenser so that people can simply help themselves to one now? 4Ucking hell fire.

[Gary the Enfield]

That's nothing to do with what I was asking.

I thought it was a fair question really.

Well this conversation is only going one way.

If the subject is difficult for you due to having a close relative involved, I can understand, to an extent, your reluctance and inability to discuss this sensibly.

You were asking if the people defending teachers all had close relatives in the profession. I asked, quite reasonably if that was the only criteria whereby they could be defended, or whether people who feel they had benefitted from education could defend teachers too. I then asked if you felt you hadn't benefitted from education. A fair question from which you seem to have shirked, questioning my understanding of the subject.

You're right actually. This conversation IS going nowhere. Because nothing you can say is going to convince me you haven't benefitted from your education. You seem an intelligent man, but you aren't self taught.

[Prufrock]

If teachers can't know anything about the 'real world' then necessarily those who work in the 'real world' can't know anything about teaching now, can they?

I can't see why a teacher must know less about the real world (though with a teaching-orientated perspective) than some one who works in business would (though with a business-orientated perspective) or law (though with a law-orientated perspective) or... you get the picture. S'just one of many careers.

Maybe those with close relations as teachers defend them because they're biased, or maybe it's because they actually know what goes on rather than half-arsed Daily Mail reckons. If you come out with bollocks like 'they don't work half the year' they simply, you don't know enough about it.

And I'm not a teacher, nor am I particularly close with anyone who is, though I have a couple of friends.

[Prufrock]

Blimey.
It's the angry thread. Within the rules of the thread Dan is allowed to be as angry and irrational as he likes. And he doesn't have to justify his opinion to anyone either.

This is very true, though may I say (and I like to think of myself as the 'curator' of this thread ) that everyone else is also allowed to get as angry and irrational about Dan's anger and irrationality as they want/can. What we can't have is reasoned and balanced posts pointing out facts, like this^. So if you must make a proper point, at least have the courtesy to go away and couch it in inflammatory wording!

[Puskas]

though I have a couple of friends.

Do you? What's it like?

I don't have any. I once thought of getting a couple, but then realised I hate people, so changed my mind.

Are they electric?

[BWFC_Insane]

If teachers can't know anything about the 'real world' then necessarily those who work in the 'real world' can't know anything about teaching now, can they?

I can't see why a teacher must know less about the real world (though with a teaching-orientated perspective) than some one who works in business would (though with a business-orientated perspective) or law (though with a law-orientated perspective) or... you get the picture. S'just one of many careers.

Maybe those with close relations as teachers defend them because they're biased, or maybe it's because they actually know what goes on rather than half-arsed Daily Mail reckons. If you come out with bollocks like 'they don't work half the year' they simply, you don't know enough about it.

And I'm not a teacher, nor am I particularly close with anyone who is, though I have a couple of friends.

I think that some of that is true. Of course you need teaching specialists or experts in how to teach. And it is unfeasible to suggest that all teachers should have done something else or even a majority of them.

I guess that my direct experience is that they often don't fully grasp what matters to businesses and employers. Teachers aren't alone in this though, educational leaders, politicians etc all have the same issues.

Education in general is I think fairly slow moving. Which is probably a nature of the beast to an extent. I will say that the best teacher I had at school spent most of his life working in engineering. I'm not saying that is a hard and fast rule. But that I think that in general education should be slightly more integrated with employers and businesses. Not hugely but just a little more.

Those on here who interview lots of graduates or school leavers (I have done) may have a different view but kids come to interviews with absolutely dreadful advice (or career knowledge) from teachers etc sometimes. And you can't help but wonder.

[Bruce Rioja]

So - what about those that have done 'real jobs in the real world' but have gone into teaching then? One of my mates that's now a teacher worked on the rigs FFS. Another is about to go through teacher training and trust me, he's seen plenty of this supposed 'real world'. What an absolute fecking nonsense it is to suggest that teachers live their lives differently to anyone else. Who suggested that they might? Oh, ah, yes.