Rose tinted spectacles..

[Andy Waller]

I'm only a slip of a thing at 36 but I've been regularly since i was a nipper.

I've had a season ticket since 1995 so i think I've seen enough of us to make a decent judgement of the situation being awful.

However, I'm too young to have seen the real crap of the 80's.

My question is this then; has it ever been this bad?

At least with the 80's wasn't the crap football offset by the cheap entrance prices/pies/beer?

Again, at least the players were more relatable and (although I think they're far, far fitter these days) more skillful.

Or is it just rose tinted spectacles?

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Interesting topic. I'm 41 and have been watching BWFC since 1985.

Players now are far far more skilful as well as fit. And thank feck, because some of the football in the 80s was awful.

What perhaps happens is that because the game is faster (and better) it's much easier to look lazy, shit r whatever.

I'm upset about how poorly the current team are playing. They may even be the most disappointing BW team in my experience. But they are very very far from being the worst players.

[Lost Leopard Spot]

I think this is the worst it's ever been, mainly due to the heady promise of the early Eddie years what with a new stadium, Europe and an owner who was local and a fan, and all that. Spoiled by Coyle, Freedman and Lennon the three mushcatears.
Unlike DSB who is looking at things now in proportion, I'm just comparing the 80s with the 00s with the 10s. I liked the 80s loved the 00s and want to see the back of the 10s

[Bruce Rioja]

Players now are far far more skilful as well as fit.

I'll be 50 in July and have been watching since 74. What I'd give to have Peter Thompson, Willie Morgan and Frank Worthington in our side again. Fitter? Yes, I'm sure. More skilful? Nah! Natural ability's natural ability.

[Andy Waller]

Interesting topic. I'm 41 and have been watching BWFC since 1985.

Players now are far far more skilful as well as fit. And thank feck, because some of the football in the 80s was awful.

What perhaps happens is that because the game is faster (and better) it's much easier to look lazy, shit r whatever.

I'm upset about how poorly the current team are playing. They may even be the most disappointing BW team in my experience. But they are very very far from being the worst players.

See, I think someone like a Tony Kelly was a far better footballer than the likes of Pratley. Completely unfit but had skill and control.

Don't get me started on the complete onefootedness of today's players....

[Andy Waller]

Players now are far far more skilful as well as fit.

I'll be 50 in July and have been watching since 74. What I'd give to have Peter Thompson, Willie Morgan and Frank Worthington in our side again. Fitter? Yes, I'm sure. More skilful? Nah! Natural ability's natural ability.

This is my point, much, much faster today but get a player with genuine skill (say a Silva at City) and people go on and on about him.

Saying that, he's totally left footed too.

[Worthy4England]

I'm not so sure it has. When we went down in 82/83 we won 11 games out of 42. Derby finished 13th, winning 10. Can't see us winning 11 this season unless something dramatic happens.

Winning 5 in 79/80 was tough. Managed just 4 draws away from home - no wins - but I think everyone sort of expected us to come down from Div 1 fairly quickly.

1980-87 was all downhill, but then when we got promoted from Div 4, it was all back uphill - and you tend to forgive shit football that's winning much easier than shit football that's losing.

[jonnycooper]

We,ve also always given Managers a fair crack at it! Phil Neal being a prime example..

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Tony Kelly was an outlier. The more typical player of the time - for our team and others - was Nicky Brookman. Sammy Lee won a European Cup. The England team featured Carlton Palmer.

Such examples could go on, from either side of the argument, but I insist that the typical/average player now is technically far superior to 20/30 years ago. The bar has definitely risen. If you watch (as live) a game from then - backpasses, bad fouls and all - compared to now it would be genuinely surprising how much so.

[Worthy4England]

The bit about faster/fitter I don't get. Undoubtedly true, but it's the same for both sides.

As for the skill bit. Today's players don't have to ride over Norman Hunter specials every 5 fecking minutes before hitting a lump of casey that weighed about 10 stones so sure, I'd expect they have more time for the odd step-over before bending the fecker into the top corner.

[Bruce Rioja]

The bit about faster/fitter I don't get. Undoubtedly true, but it's the same for both sides.

As for the skill bit. Today's players don't have to ride over Norman Hunter specials every 5 fecking minutes before hitting a lump of casey that weighed about 10 stones so sure, I'd expect they have more time for the odd step-over before bending the fecker into the top corner.

And at the risk of sounding like a latter day version of my Grandfather, even non-league teams get to play on bowling green-esque pitches for an entire season now, in Predator boots kicking lightweight balls.

[Enoch]

The bit about faster/fitter I don't get. Undoubtedly true, but it's the same for both sides.

As for the skill bit. Today's players don't have to ride over Norman Hunter specials every 5 fecking minutes before hitting a lump of casey that weighed about 10 stones so sure, I'd expect they have more time for the odd step-over before bending the fecker into the top corner.

And at the risk of sounding like a latter day version of my Grandfather, even non-league teams get to play on bowling green-esque pitches for an entire season now, in Predator boots kicking lightweight balls.

Thanks, Granddad.

[Bruce Rioja]

The bit about faster/fitter I don't get. Undoubtedly true, but it's the same for both sides.

As for the skill bit. Today's players don't have to ride over Norman Hunter specials every 5 fecking minutes before hitting a lump of casey that weighed about 10 stones so sure, I'd expect they have more time for the odd step-over before bending the fecker into the top corner.

And at the risk of sounding like a latter day version of my Grandfather, even non-league teams get to play on bowling green-esque pitches for an entire season now, in Predator boots kicking lightweight balls.

Thanks, Granddad.

Ne rien.

[Worthy4England]

The bit about faster/fitter I don't get. Undoubtedly true, but it's the same for both sides.

As for the skill bit. Today's players don't have to ride over Norman Hunter specials every 5 fecking minutes before hitting a lump of casey that weighed about 10 stones so sure, I'd expect they have more time for the odd step-over before bending the fecker into the top corner.

And at the risk of sounding like a latter day version of my Grandfather, even non-league teams get to play on bowling green-esque pitches for an entire season now, in Predator boots kicking lightweight balls.

Aye, when I posted, I thought should've mentioned the pitches...don't recall much in the way of undersoil heating either. Hit the deck and you knew you'd landed.

[TANGODANCER]

Burnden Park, 1974. Bolton v Stoke. The first big game ever to be played on the Sabath. We won 3-2 thanks to a John Byrom hatrick. Must have been him in the "Doomed" banner. The club couldn't charge and admission was by programme only. .....The crowd celebrated on Manchester Road and behind the Burnden Stand where they were confronted by campaigners carrying placards warning of the evils of partaking in sport on the Sabbath. ( from The Bolton News..


Team was : Siddall, Ritson, Nicholson, Rimmer, P. Jones, Waldron, Byrom, G. Jones, Greaves, Whatmore, Thomson. Sub: Lee for Rimmer.

[Harry Genshaw]

The games undoubtedly quicker but I'm not having it that it was better.

I started watching them in 1975. The 1979/80 & the 1995/96 relegated sides were the most outclassed sides I ever followed but they were both Premiership teams. This lot aren't far behind them.

[BWFC_Insane]

It doesn't really matter whether a player from a different era would survive today's or not for the purpose of this discussion. Suspect Tony Kelly wouldn't make a professional club in this era at all. But the teams he was a part of generated a huge amount of enjoyment for the fans who went and watched.

It is more than just success or lack of. The ground is flat as a pancake. The cost of food and drink huge for a product that really is dreadful. The whole match day experience is no longer defined by the game but by the people you go with and spend match day with. That can't be healthy entirely.

I'm not one to bash the ground or its position. I think the move was necessary and in the premiership high points it rocked and the match day was a real buzz. Half empty with interest generally waning the whole thing comes under more of a spotlight and the experience of going isn't very good. A while ago we took the kids of a friend who doesn't like football but their kids do, they are mad about it and pestered their mum to go to a game for a solid year. They haven't asked to go since. This is the problem the atmosphere, the service, the game, the products on offer are all shocking. Especially when you consider the prices. If the football was half decent little else matters, but when things are rock bottom all round as they are now, things stand out.

We aren't going to recreate Burnden in the 80's and 90's and nor should we try. But there is a desperate need for some genuine soul and character to be found soon. Something that says this is Bolton Wanderers, even if the team on the pitch can't.

[Peter Thompson]

The atmosphere in the stadium has feck all to do with location or the price of food & drink, I'm extremely proud of the Macron / Reebok to think when I started watching us in the late 70's early 80's I could have only dreamt that we would have a fantastic stadium like we have now - even all these years later I'm still proud as feck every time I either drive past the ground or walk up on match days.

The current atmosphere is entirely down to the shite football on the pitch that the fans endure week in week out, season in season out which we've had since the Stoke Wembley semi - which IMO was the start of our alarming decline.

As you say if the product on the pitch was decent no one would moan, and to be honest most don't moan about the location or food just about the shite football - because its fecking dire and the apathy amongst the fans is alarming, and who can blame them, when the 2nd goal went in yesterday and many got up & left (me included) there was little booing or abuse shouted at the manager or players it was just fans shaking their heads, many walking out saying how sick they are of watching such shite.


I've said before the fans who have stuck with the club & who continually go week after week sitting through that dross deserve medals -

[BWFC_Insane]

The atmosphere in the stadium has feck all to do with location or the price of food & drink, I'm extremely proud of the Macron / Reebok to think when I started watching us in the late 70's early 80's I could have only dreamt that we had have a fantastic stadium like we have now - even all these years later I'm still proud as feck every time I either drive past the ground or walk up on watch days.

The current atmosphere is entirely down to the shite football on the pitch that the fans endure week in week out, season in season out which we've had since the Stoke Wembley semi - which IMO was the start of our alarming decline.

As you say if the product on the pitch was decent no one would moan, and to be honest most don't moan about the location or food just about the shite football - because its fecking dire and the apathy amongst the fans is alarming, and who can blame them, when the 2nd goal went in yesterday and many got up & left (me included) there was little booing or abuse shouted at the manager or players it was just fans shaking their heads, many walking out saying how sick they are of watching such shite.


I've said before the fans who have stuck with the club & who continually go week after week sitting through that dross deserve medals -

Other clubs have similarly struggled for years and maintained a better atmosphere for match days.

[Peter Thompson]

The atmosphere in the stadium has feck all to do with location or the price of food & drink, I'm extremely proud of the Macron / Reebok to think when I started watching us in the late 70's early 80's I could have only dreamt that we had have a fantastic stadium like we have now - even all these years later I'm still proud as feck every time I either drive past the ground or walk up on watch days.

The current atmosphere is entirely down to the shite football on the pitch that the fans endure week in week out, season in season out which we've had since the Stoke Wembley semi - which IMO was the start of our alarming decline.

As you say if the product on the pitch was decent no one would moan, and to be honest most don't moan about the location or food just about the shite football - because its fecking dire and the apathy amongst the fans is alarming, and who can blame them, when the 2nd goal went in yesterday and many got up & left (me included) there was little booing or abuse shouted at the manager or players it was just fans shaking their heads, many walking out saying how sick they are of watching such shite.


I've said before the fans who have stuck with the club & who continually go week after week sitting through that dross deserve medals -

Other clubs have similarly struggled for years and maintained a better atmosphere for match days.

Well feck off and watch them then if you don't like the atmosphere or match day experience - as I've said it would improve significantly if we had a half decent team to watch and to get behind, its a chore now fans go out of loyalty rather than the expectant experience or entertainment.

I'm seriously amazed how loyal the fans currently are....unfortunately I'm not one of them as I'm now fecking it off until things change either on or off the pitch, but I take my hat off to those who will continue to go I really do.