The Politics Thread

[William the White]

If you mean me, my views have always been on the left, but certainly not entrenched. They have gone from a vapid social democracy, to anarchism, to a particularly vile version of dogmatic Trotskyism, to the Labour Party, and standing for council election (and failing to win, thank FFT!) to the guy with the fairly non-entrenched position of wanting PR and a party uniting socialist and green ideas able to form a coherent opposition to the current dominant ideology espoused by all major parties. I have in addition squeezed in CND and other anti-war campaigns, significant trade union activity, fatherhood and a lot of reading.

Entrenched? Less so than Douglas Haig, I suggest. Or i suppose, I put it you...

And, seemingly, squeezed into the top ten percent of salary earners in the country. Which came as a surprise to me but didn't make me want to vote Tory.

One of my tutors at Uni is involved in anarchism and I actually spend few classes on the topic. I can understand the appeal of anarchism but I feel that it's to utopian and couldn't be viable throughout all of society, each to their own I suppose though.

Oh, I agree. I was utopian throughout the anarchist years of my life - approx 17-24... Youthful idealism when I was hoping to help build a world with no God and no masters and no private property, slowly and sadly decays into failing to win a council seat in Wednesbury for the Labour Party... which uni are you at, relentless?

Well I really messed the quoting up on that one. (Slightly better now)

I'm at Queens University studying International Politics and Conflict studies. The combination of the modules sold it for me, there's modules focusing on political theory, European politics (EU related) and the global politics system focusing on the role conflict plays. This semester I've modules on UK/Ireland political system, one called media, politics and conflict and the last module is on Northern Ireland which is always enlightening.

That looks to me like a really intellectually demanding course... excellent, just excellent! Hope you enjoy it.

I've loved all my (long ago) visits to Belfast... One of which was as the guest of the guy who founded Belfast Anarchists in the late 1960s/early 1970s... Who knew how to spend the night finely with booze and politics and passion and dreams and the craic more than anyone I ever met... And who later went on to write what I'm told is an excellent history of poteen...

[Montreal Wanderer]

If you mean me, my views have always been on the left, but certainly not entrenched. They have gone from a vapid social democracy, to anarchism, to a particularly vile version of dogmatic Trotskyism, to the Labour Party, and standing for council election (and failing to win, thank FFT!) to the guy with the fairly non-entrenched position of wanting PR and a party uniting socialist and green ideas able to form a coherent opposition to the current dominant ideology espoused by all major parties. I have in addition squeezed in CND and other anti-war campaigns, significant trade union activity, fatherhood and a lot of reading.

Entrenched? Less so than Douglas Haig, I suggest. Or i suppose, I put it you...

And, seemingly, squeezed into the top ten percent of salary earners in the country. Which came as a surprise to me but didn't make me want to vote Tory.

One of my tutors at Uni is involved in anarchism and I actually spend few classes on the topic. I can understand the appeal of anarchism but I feel that it's to utopian and couldn't be viable throughout all of society, each to their own I suppose though.

Oh, I agree. I was utopian throughout the anarchist years of my life - approx 17-24... Youthful idealism when I was hoping to help build a world with no God and no masters and no private property, slowly and sadly decays into failing to win a council seat in Wednesbury for the Labour Party... which uni are you at, relentless?

Well I really messed the quoting up on that one. (Slightly better now)

I'm at Queens University studying International Politics and Conflict studies. The combination of the modules sold it for me, there's modules focusing on political theory, European politics (EU related) and the global politics system focusing on the role conflict plays. This semester I've modules on UK/Ireland political system, one called media, politics and conflict and the last module is on Northern Ireland which is always enlightening.

That looks to me like a really intellectually demanding course... excellent, just excellent! Hope you enjoy it.

I've loved all my (long ago) visits to Belfast... One of which was as the guest of the guy who founded Belfast Anarchists in the late 1960s/early 1970s... Who knew how to spend the night finely with booze and politics and passion and dreams and the craic more than anyone I ever met... And who later went on to write what I'm told is an excellent history of poteen...

Would that be the late John McGuffin?

[William the White]

Would that be the late John McGuffin?

It was indeed John McGuffin. I didn't know he'd died. I feel a bit sad about that.

[Bruce Rioja]

Would that be the late John McGuffin?

It was indeed John McGuffin. I didn't know he'd died. I feel a bit sad about that.

Monty once told me that he actually got to meet Hugh MacLennan, William. A man whom, I imagine, you'd have admired greatly.

[Lost Leopard Spot]

Karzai, is he a homonym for khazi?
He fecking needs to be. Now there's a man running scared of the Taliban
Here's a prediction. If he lives long enough he won't be President of Afghanistan this time next year, nor will he be living in his own country, again.

[Montreal Wanderer]

Would that be the late John McGuffin?

It was indeed John McGuffin. I didn't know he'd died. I feel a bit sad about that.

Monty once told me that he actually got to meet Hugh MacLennan, William. A man whom, I imagine, you'd have admired greatly.

Actually I had lunch with him at the Faculty Club on a number of occasions. Some eight or ten people would sit there at round tables. Maclennan was a star and gave his opinions on the topic of the moment. I was a junior staff member and merely listened to the great men around me. Then MacLennan retired and left my ken for twenty years. I ended up as the literary executor of MacLennan's friend and colleague, John Peters Humphrey, who wrote the first draft of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. Humphrey reintroduced me to Hugh when they were in their mid-80s and I did a better job of holding up my end of the conversation. However, I didn't think MacLennan had much fame outside of Canada or that WtW might have read his novels.

[William the White]

Would that be the late John McGuffin?

It was indeed John McGuffin. I didn't know he'd died. I feel a bit sad about that.

Monty once told me that he actually got to meet Hugh MacLennan, William. A man whom, I imagine, you'd have admired greatly.

Actually I had lunch with him at the Faculty Club on a number of occasions. Some eight or ten people would sit there at round tables. Maclennan was a star and gave his opinions on the topic of the moment. I was a junior staff member and merely listened to the great men around me. Then MacLennan retired and left my ken for twenty years. I ended up as the literary executor of MacLennan's friend and colleague, John Peters Humphrey, who wrote the first draft of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. Humphrey reintroduced me to Hugh when they were in their mid-80s and I did a better job of holding up my end of the conversation. However, I didn't think MacLennan had much fame outside of Canada or that WtW might have read his novels.

I don't know his work at all, I'm afraid. And the wikipedia piece doesn't inspire me to research further. But perhaps Monty might try to give a flavour of it. I note that Leonard cohen was one of his students though. And wonder if Monty had lunch with him at any time...

[Montreal Wanderer]

Actually I had lunch with him at the Faculty Club on a number of occasions. Some eight or ten people would sit there at round tables. Maclennan was a star and gave his opinions on the topic of the moment. I was a junior staff member and merely listened to the great men around me. Then MacLennan retired and left my ken for twenty years. I ended up as the literary executor of MacLennan's friend and colleague, John Peters Humphrey, who wrote the first draft of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. Humphrey reintroduced me to Hugh when they were in their mid-80s and I did a better job of holding up my end of the conversation. However, I didn't think MacLennan had much fame outside of Canada or that WtW might have read his novels.

I don't know his work at all, I'm afraid. And the wikipedia piece doesn't inspire me to research further. But perhaps Monty might try to give a flavour of it. I note that Leonard cohen was one of his students though. And wonder if Monty had lunch with him at any time...

Leonard Cohen was actually a lecturer at the University before he became rich and famous. He used to come to the library where I slaved away as a reference librarian (this was before I could afford to join the Faculty Club). This would be just after Suzanne came out (say 1969-70) but before the royalties had really got going - at this point he was essentially a poet. He may have been MacLennan's student but he was I believe more influenced by his other profs - Louis Dudek and Irving Layton.

As a novelist I don't think MacLennan would rate highly on an international scale. He wrote well enough but the topics would not resonate beyond Canada. The Two Solitudes was about the French and English living in Montreal and never interacting with one another, while Barometer Rising was about the great 1916 Halifax naval dockyard explosion. He had honour in his own country, but little elsewhere. Unless you are a fan of the Tragically Hip, who based a song on his novel The Watch That Ends the Night .

[Bruce Rioja]

Unless you are a fan of the Tragically Hip, who based a song on his novel The Watch That Ends the Night .

Indeed. The song's called Courage (For Hugh MacLennan). I hadn't heard of him before so had looked him up. This is what led to me initially asking you about him.

[Montreal Wanderer]

Unless you are a fan of the Tragically Hip, who based a song on his novel The Watch That Ends the Night .

Indeed. The song's called Courage (For Hugh MacLennan). I hadn't heard of him before so had looked him up. This is what led to me initially asking you about him.

I had not read The Watch That Ends the Night but I've looked up the passage that inspired the song which may interest you:

But that night as I drove back to Montreal I at least discovered this: that there is no simple explanation for anything important any of us do, and that the human tragedy, or the human irony, consists in the necessity of living with the consequences of actions performed under the pressure of compulsions so obscure we do not and cannot understand them.

[Lord Kangana]

I like that.

[Bruce Rioja]

Unless you are a fan of the Tragically Hip, who based a song on his novel The Watch That Ends the Night .

Indeed. The song's called Courage (For Hugh MacLennan). I hadn't heard of him before so had looked him up. This is what led to me initially asking you about him.

I had not read The Watch That Ends the Night but I've looked up the passage that inspired the song which may interest you:

But that night as I drove back to Montreal I at least discovered this: that there is no simple explanation for anything important any of us do, and that the human tragedy, or the human irony, consists in the necessity of living with the consequences of actions performed under the pressure of compulsions so obscure we do not and cannot understand them.

Ah, most of which they robbed absolutely verbatim for the middle eight. Cheers, Monty.

[Montreal Wanderer]

Unless you are a fan of the Tragically Hip, who based a song on his novel The Watch That Ends the Night .

Indeed. The song's called Courage (For Hugh MacLennan). I hadn't heard of him before so had looked him up. This is what led to me initially asking you about him.

I had not read The Watch That Ends the Night but I've looked up the passage that inspired the song which may interest you:

But that night as I drove back to Montreal I at least discovered this: that there is no simple explanation for anything important any of us do, and that the human tragedy, or the human irony, consists in the necessity of living with the consequences of actions performed under the pressure of compulsions so obscure we do not and cannot understand them.

Ah, most of which they robbed absolutely verbatim for the middle eight. Cheers, Monty.

Ah, not robbery since they attributed it... closer to academic research.

[Hoboh]

Revealed
How the East Europeans can afford to undercut wages of British Nationals!

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... inals.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[William the White]

Revealed
How the East Europeans can afford to undercut wages of British Nationals!

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... inals.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Listen, hoboh, you lazy sod, the great joy of reading your posts is the volcano of half mad rabid bile that erupts on the eyeball when you click onto it. Just posting another link to the Daily Mail is never, ever going to satisfy your fans, of which I am the most devoted.

This is material that once upon a time you could have sizzled into a stonking, stenchy hell broth.

But gone oh gone is hoboh wild, instead here's hoboh, meek and mild.

Get back to telling the truth as you see it, let us have it, that's what we enjoy. Or, frankly, I'm going to stop reading your posts.

That said - the most shocking thing in that article is that the toilet block is on the market for £300,000.

[LeverEnd]

Revealed
How the East Europeans can afford to undercut wages of British Nationals!

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... inals.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Listen, hoboh, you lazy sod, the great joy of reading your posts is the volcano of half mad rabid bile that erupts on the eyeball when you click onto it. Just posting another link to the Daily Mail is never, ever going to satisfy your fans, of which I am the most devoted.

This is material that once upon a time you could have sizzled into a stonking, stenchy hell broth.

But gone oh gone is hoboh wild, instead here's hoboh, meek and mild.

Get back to telling the truth as you see it, let us have it, that's what we enjoy. Or, frankly, I'm going to stop reading your posts.

That said - the most shocking thing in that article is that the toilet block is on the market for £300,000.

That's the same as Craig Davies. (insert your own joke here).

[Lost Leopard Spot]

Revealed
How the East Europeans can afford to undercut wages of British Nationals!

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... inals.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Listen, hoboh, you lazy sod, the great joy of reading your posts is the volcano of half mad rabid bile that erupts on the eyeball when you click onto it. Just posting another link to the Daily Mail is never, ever going to satisfy your fans, of which I am the most devoted.

This is material that once upon a time you could have sizzled into a stonking, stenchy hell broth.

But gone oh gone is hoboh wild, instead here's hoboh, meek and mild.

Get back to telling the truth as you see it, let us have it, that's what we enjoy. Or, frankly, I'm going to stop reading your posts.

That said - the most shocking thing in that article is that the toilet block is on the market for £300,000.

That's the same as Craig Davies. (insert your own joke here).

What? does Craig Davies spout wild incoherent rants whilst sowing links to the Daily Mail left, right and centre too?

(well, you told me to, )

[Lost Leopard Spot]

Yesterday I came across the Jubilee River. Not heard of it before, but I don't understand why it is not a huge political scandal. The hoi polloi of Wraysbury are presently up to their necks in water whilst the patricians frequenting the Riverside and Fat Duck in Bray, the dorms of Eton and the castles of Royal Windsor are going about their merry business dry shod. If it was an equitable affair they would all be paddling about in half an inch of water but no, the taxpayer has spent over a hundred and ten million spondulicks on building an artificial watercourse to take excess water west of Bray and dump it some seven miles further downstream east of Windsor. I shit you not. Didn't anybody wonder what would happen to the poor sods who live in Wraysbury when not only does the Thames overflow but all the water that didn't flood Bray, Eton and Windsor is dumped in their houses too?

[Lost Leopard Spot]

^ that up there (Jubilee River - in effect a man made canal that takes water around Eton and dumps it in the poorer suburb of Wraysbury), here it is graphically outlined

The entire extent of the Jubilee River is to be found where the only extensive non red bit of the Thames is in that graphic (the orange stretch just west of Slough on the map)

Edit: been doing more research and even the BBC are in on a cover-up. Their video story ... a helicopter ride down the flooded Thames... cuts out the entire Jubille River section, after Chertsey the footage is edited to resume at Maidenhead [2:43-2:45 on the video] http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-26146361

Directly downstream of where the Jubilee River dumps the Thames-borne excess are (in this order) Datchet, Wraysbury, Egham, Staines, Chertsey. You may well have heard and seen them on the news. Upstream on the Thames and therefore protected by the Jubilee River are (in this order) Eton, Windsor, Eton Wick, Dorney, Bray all of which are unnewsworthy lacking flooding (having dumped the water further downstream).

[Lost Leopard Spot]

^ up there, just then...I brought you a conspiracy theory, only this one has evidence. A contemporary political scandal, and not a single comment on it from the resident politicos. (This is where thebish will be sadly missed, by me anyway).
Anyway, additionally, it is now reported that Environment Agency staff have had to be withdrawn after hostility from the pubic [p9 today's Times] because of the issue I highlighted [not reported in daily rags, but reliably informed by a resident who is a friend].

So, Dave the tit says "Money is no object". I understood him immediately. The logic is this: an object exists, it occupies space, but money is virtual, made up, doesn't really exist except as a concept. So money is not really there, it is in effect fictional. So there are no blank cheques, there are in fact no cheques to be had at all because money is not an object.