Today I'm angry about.....

[Worthy4England]

This takes the p*ss
Please read it all before commenting, I know you wouldn't normally imagine my position as one of support, but this is reminds me of the Gurkha situation.

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016 ... lic-outcry" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Surely you have to apply the law equitably, so I guess you're now ok with anyone who has illegally overstayed their welcome, got treatment on the NHS illegally and isn't a British National to stay? (I'm in favor of her staying btw), but I'd expect the same conditions to apply to anyone.

I believe in debt to those who fought to preserve our island and also the fact she was born under the British flag.

It may surprise you that in my opinion anyone who worked closely with British forces in Iraq, Afghanistan etc. should have a right to reside in the UK, more so than some roaming ex Romanian resident!

Great news. All our allies from previous wars count! That's great foresight Hobes.

[Hoboh]

This takes the p*ss
Please read it all before commenting, I know you wouldn't normally imagine my position as one of support, but this is reminds me of the Gurkha situation.

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016 ... lic-outcry" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Surely you have to apply the law equitably, so I guess you're now ok with anyone who has illegally overstayed their welcome, got treatment on the NHS illegally and isn't a British National to stay? (I'm in favor of her staying btw), but I'd expect the same conditions to apply to anyone.

I believe in debt to those who fought to preserve our island and also the fact she was born under the British flag.

It may surprise you that in my opinion anyone who worked closely with British forces in Iraq, Afghanistan etc. should have a right to reside in the UK, more so than some roaming ex Romanian resident!

Great news. All our allies from previous wars count! That's great foresight Hobes.

Not many left alive now matey!
And the important thing, not all want to come to the UK.

[Worthy4England]

Worth a try...

[thebish]

Not many left alive now matey!
And the important thing, not all want to come to the UK.

really??? I'm gonna frame that!

[Enoch]

They've altered the level of proof required.

I don't think they have, just said that proof is required.

They have. Previously the test was, I think, that a secondary defendent could have foreseen the consequence of the primary party's action. Now the test is that you have to prove that they knew.

Indeed, 'could have', subjective, 'prove that', proof.

Anyhow, my question remains this; in the cause of locking up a good number of "scrotes", is it acceptable for a number of "non scrotes" to be banged up as a bit of collateral?

[Worthy4England]

They've altered the level of proof required.

I don't think they have, just said that proof is required.

They have. Previously the test was, I think, that a secondary defendent could have foreseen the consequence of the primary party's action. Now the test is that you have to prove that they knew.

Indeed, 'could have', subjective, 'prove that', proof.

Anyhow, my question remains this; in the cause of locking up a good number of "scrotes", is it acceptable for a number of "non scrotes" to be banged up as a bit of collateral?

Depends on the circumstances. So we're agreed that the balance of scrote bashing ability has changed. That's good.

If we're looking at acceptability, I'll take it from the view of a victim and their family, every time thanks. We make far too many laws that look at fairness from the perpetrators point of view. If you'd rather, I'll withdraw the reference to the word scrotes and we can for arguments sake call them people so there's clearly no differentiation. I actually didn't have any of the participants in a non-scrote bracket.

Is there a particular scenario you think is at issue here that involves scrotes and non-scrotes?

[Lost Leopard Spot]

They've altered the level of proof required.

I don't think they have, just said that proof is required.

They have. Previously the test was, I think, that a secondary defendent could have foreseen the consequence of the primary party's action. Now the test is that you have to prove that they knew.

Indeed, 'could have', subjective, 'prove that', proof.

Anyhow, my question remains this; in the cause of locking up a good number of "scrotes", is it acceptable for a number of "non scrotes" to be banged up as a bit of collateral?

Yes.
That happens with every single law. Even Drunk and Disorderly, I've know people quite clearly not d&d done for it. Bent coppers cannot be legislated for.

[Worthy4England]

They've altered the level of proof required.

I don't think they have, just said that proof is required.

They have. Previously the test was, I think, that a secondary defendent could have foreseen the consequence of the primary party's action. Now the test is that you have to prove that they knew.

Indeed, 'could have', subjective, 'prove that', proof.

Anyhow, my question remains this; in the cause of locking up a good number of "scrotes", is it acceptable for a number of "non scrotes" to be banged up as a bit of collateral?

Yes.
That happens with every single law. Even Drunk and Disorderly, I've know people quite clearly not d&d done for it. Bent coppers cannot be legislated for.

Might have fallen foul a few times...

For me it's run like this.

1) I thought I was not guilty, they thought I was guilty, they lied a lot. Result - guilty
2) I thought I was technically guilty, they thought I was guilty, didn't lie coz they thought they were rock solid, recorder pointed out it didn't actually matter - not guilty
3) I thought I was guilty, fessed up, they still lied about shit on sentencing, no fcr really believed them.
4) Poll tax non-payment. They thought I was guilty, I told 'em I didn't care as long as they didn't try my in a court with 5 other people, with whom I had no known or alleged association. Proud to be guilty as charged.

[Enoch]

Is there a particular scenario you think is at issue here that involves scrotes and non-scrotes?

There is, but not one I'm particularly up for picking over on the board. I posted in this thread on 3rd December about a particular case where a lad was convicted via joint enterprise for the actions of another. I've witnessed the effect that conviction has had on his family. The boys only real crime was not having the sense to be somewhere else.

I'm not arguing for justice for the guilty, I will always be pro justice for the innocent.

It's what sets us nice Brits apart.

[Worthy4England]

Understand not going into it. There are a number of options when your mate is being a dick in a pub. If he choses to talk his mate down or walks away coz he can't then it's real tough for the police to get a real association. You can of course join in to support your mate then I think you get what you get. I've done all three depending on how I've read a situation. Just lucky nowt real serious happened.

[Enoch]

There are a number of options when your mate is being a dick in a pub. If he choses to talk his mate down or walks away coz he can't then it's real tough for the police to get a real association. You can of course join in to support your mate then I think you get what you get. I've done all three depending on how I've read a situation. Just lucky nowt real serious happened.

Entirely possible to stand about as a wide eyed child with no sense of what to do and it be judged that one could have foreseen the consequence of the primary party's action.

[Lost Leopard Spot]

There are a number of options when your mate is being a dick in a pub. If he choses to talk his mate down or walks away coz he can't then it's real tough for the police to get a real association. You can of course join in to support your mate then I think you get what you get. I've done all three depending on how I've read a situation. Just lucky nowt real serious happened.

Entirely possible to stand about as a wide eyed child with no sense of what to do and it be judged that one could have foreseen the consequence of the primary party's action.

Highly unlikely to be convicted in that case.
Sometimes family and friends see a wide eyed innocent child when the community see a scrote.

[Enoch]

There are a number of options when your mate is being a dick in a pub. If he choses to talk his mate down or walks away coz he can't then it's real tough for the police to get a real association. You can of course join in to support your mate then I think you get what you get. I've done all three depending on how I've read a situation. Just lucky nowt real serious happened.

Entirely possible to stand about as a wide eyed child with no sense of what to do and it be judged that one could have foreseen the consequence of the primary party's action.

Highly unlikely to be convicted in that case.
Sometimes family and friends see a wide eyed innocent child when the community see a scrote.

Very true, sometimes it'll be otherwise.

[LeverEnd]

Get in the fecking sea you c*nt.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-35652150

[Prufrock]

There was an article in the guardian the other day about a guy who lived as a badger for a summer AND took his 8 year old kid. Wanker.

[thebish]

There was an article in the guardian the other day about a guy who lived as a badger for a summer AND took his 8 year old kid. Wanker.

did they spend the whole summer getting run over and rotting by the side of the A30?

[Hoboh]

There are a number of options when your mate is being a dick in a pub. If he choses to talk his mate down or walks away coz he can't then it's real tough for the police to get a real association. You can of course join in to support your mate then I think you get what you get. I've done all three depending on how I've read a situation. Just lucky nowt real serious happened.

Entirely possible to stand about as a wide eyed child with no sense of what to do and it be judged that one could have foreseen the consequence of the primary party's action.

Highly unlikely to be convicted in that case.
Sometimes family and friends see a wide eyed innocent child when the community see a scrote.

Very true, sometimes it'll be otherwise.

Rarely!

All scrotes and villains tend to be 'salt of the earth' types.

Oh he was good to his mum (and a complete nice person to everyone else), how many times have we heard this?

[Lost Leopard Spot]

There are a number of options when your mate is being a dick in a pub. If he choses to talk his mate down or walks away coz he can't then it's real tough for the police to get a real association. You can of course join in to support your mate then I think you get what you get. I've done all three depending on how I've read a situation. Just lucky nowt real serious happened.

Entirely possible to stand about as a wide eyed child with no sense of what to do and it be judged that one could have foreseen the consequence of the primary party's action.

Highly unlikely to be convicted in that case.
Sometimes family and friends see a wide eyed innocent child when the community see a scrote.

Very true, sometimes it'll be otherwise.

Rarely!

All scrotes and villains tend to be 'salt of the earth' types.

Oh he was good to his mum (and a complete tw*t to everyone else), how many times have we heard this?

Indeed. The Krays, salt of the Earth don't you know. Mohamed Emwazi, a beautiful human. Dr Crippen, wouldn't harm a fly...

[Prufrock]

There are a number of options when your mate is being a dick in a pub. If he choses to talk his mate down or walks away coz he can't then it's real tough for the police to get a real association. You can of course join in to support your mate then I think you get what you get. I've done all three depending on how I've read a situation. Just lucky nowt real serious happened.

Entirely possible to stand about as a wide eyed child with no sense of what to do and it be judged that one could have foreseen the consequence of the primary party's action.

Highly unlikely to be convicted in that case.
Sometimes family and friends see a wide eyed innocent child when the community see a scrote.

Very true, sometimes it'll be otherwise.

Rarely!

All scrotes and villains tend to be 'salt of the earth' types.

Oh he was good to his mum (and a complete tw*t to everyone else), how many times have we heard this?

You hear it every time a soldier is killed too. Are they all scrotes and villains too?

[Hoboh]

Were they out committing crime?