The Promotion Commotion Transfer Thread 2017

[bristol_Wanderer3]

The twittersphere seems to be saying "up to £6m". Probably a number the two clubs have agreed to report on based on previous comments attributed to Ken. I personally would guess £3-4m with a big add on if they get promoted, and maybe others for appearances and a sell on clause.

Part of me had allowed myself to believe that Ken had some way to fund the club using his own money, or investors he might know. It is pretty clear that isn't the case. The club has to finance itself. The other part of me knew that was the case.

Hard to see us staying up right now....

[bristol_Wanderer3]

Another thought, I wonder if we now go 3-5-2? Can't see 4-5-1 working without Madine. At least 3-5-2 allows us to get ALF in there, maybe alongside Ameobi?? Obviously we need to sign more attacking players if we can. If we do get Chungy he can play in behind them. We might squeeze some clean sheets out of it I guess...

It will be interesting to see Parky's reaction. Was he really banking on Madine staying? Or did he know there were going to have to be sales in this window?

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

You've forgotten Charsley, FWIW, but otherwise yep

Yeah a teen who didn’t even make the bench last time round. Reckon he’s going to have a huge impact......

I didn't say he was any good; I was merely adding to your apparent summary of our transfer window ("to get back to the squad strength we went into January with"). Again, fact not opinion.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Another thought, I wonder if we now go 3-5-2? Can't see 4-5-1 working without Madine. At least 3-5-2 allows us to get ALF in there, maybe alongside Ameobi?? Obviously we need to sign more attacking players if we can. If we do get Chungy he can play in behind them. We might squeeze some clean sheets out of it I guess...

I wondered this too but the squad make-up doesn't suit it. We've got a million wingers and although some could be squeezed in - Chungy at 10, Sammy off the front man, Morais at RWB, Buckley also an option at 10 - that would be to the detriment of Vela, allegedly a key man, and Little, one of our most impressive players. We've also only got three centre-backs (unless and until Burke returns) and none of them are what you'd call fast across the grass. And that's before you return to the reality of how easily teams at this level picked us off by passing in behind the wing-backs. I don't think it'd get us more clean sheets,quite the opposite: we might have the chance of scoring more but also conceding more.

It will be interesting to see Parky's reaction. Was he really banking on Madine staying? Or did he know there were going to have to be sales in this window?

It will indeed. He's not daft and will know that behind Ken's flowery sermons there are hard financial facts - not just of our situation but of Madine's (or Maxine's, to use BWFCi's presumably accidental but somehow suitable typo). Call me credulous but I do believe there's a difference between having to sell for the club's sake and making a personnel decision based on market value and the potential negative effect on the player involved.

I think PP wil be hideously disappointed but perhaps not entirely surprised.

[Peter Thompson]

He's not that good anyway....he's just Parkinson's only way of playing (but that's more down to Parkinson's limitations than owt else) & he's just going through a purple patch, if we'd have given him a new longer term contract on better wages he'd revert to the Madine of old, perhaps it may make Parkinson play football now instead of hoofball every week, although someone will need to show him how to.

It'll be fine - CYL & the dutch lad will more than make up for Madine....

Absolute bollocks.Palace have injuries from tonight to two attacking players so Lee seems far more unlikely anyway.

But the rest, he's 60% of our goals. And we aren't suddenly going to become Man City. We are a team with limited ability with a midfield of Darren Pratley, Karla Henry and Josh Vela who found a way to get results thanks almost entirely to Madine's all round game and goals.

We are going to sell Madine for peanuts. And bring in a big Dutch lad on loan who is probably half fit and almost certainly will take some time to adjust.

That's it. The limits of the rest of the team are still there. Whoever plays up front needs to score goals and lead the line just like Madine was. Or Vela our attacking midfield player has to step up. Our squad is likely going to be significantly weaker than the one we entered into January with and that one was barely sufficient if at all.

And your mate Ken has bought the club for nothing and invested nowt and continues to sell players to pay the bills. How will he pay for our 5M deficit next season?

And breathe....calm down a bit, count to 10 and perhaps wait & see how the day pans out before having a tantrum. Who knows perhaps Madine has told the club in the last few days that he wants to go and they had no choice ?

[Harry Genshaw]

As far as I can tell this whole £6m deal agreed story, is a made up tweet from some goon that's been repeated/retweeted several times over.

TW rules - no PSG no deal

[bristol_Wanderer3]

As far as I can tell this whole £6m deal agreed story, is a made up tweet from some goon that's been repeated/retweeted several times over.

TW rules - no PSG no deal

Iles is stating that figure this morning in his deadline day blog. I do agree though it is not cut and dried yet. I am sure from a pure footy angle Madine would like to stay here and continue working with Parky, who has got him performing at levels that where hitherto unimaginable.

[BWFC_Insane]

There is no way on god's earth this deal is 6M up front. Its probably 2M plus extras depending upon performance and promotion for Cardiff.

[bristol_Wanderer3]

I wondered this too but the squad make-up doesn't suit it. We've got a million wingers and although some could be squeezed in - Chungy at 10, Sammy off the front man, Morais at RWB, Buckley also an option at 10 - that would be to the detriment of Vela, allegedly a key man, and Little, one of our most impressive players. We've also only got three centre-backs (unless and until Burke returns) and none of them are what you'd call fast across the grass. And that's before you return to the reality of how easily teams at this level picked us off by passing in behind the wing-backs. I don't think it'd get us more clean sheets,quite the opposite: we might have the chance of scoring more but also conceding more.

I think the problem earlier in the season with 3-5-2 was the Cullen/Karacan midfield base. Teams were getting too much possession in areas where they could hurt us. Henry makes a massive difference. It worked at Sheffield United recently, though tbf Sheffield are struggling to score at home against most teams at the moment. I guess Little has more chance than Morais of being able to be a proper wing back who can get up and down and prevent us being exploited. Robinson on the other side is made for it. It would be a waste of all those wingers I agree. I am struggling to see us scoring in a 4-5-1 without Madine though. We already had stopped creating many chances, really since the Burton game. Since then we have scored 5 goals in 7 games, with Madine scoring 4 and creating the other.

[BWFC_Insane]

As far as I can tell this whole £6m deal agreed story, is a made up tweet from some goon that's been repeated/retweeted several times over.

TW rules - no PSG no deal

A freelance sports journalist who used to work for sky sports is the source. But Nixon was also saying similar earlier in the day. Its obvious we've accepted some sort of bid.

I'd love Gary to say "nah I'm staying" but realistically if Iles claim's that Cardiff are doubling his salary are true, I can't for one minute expect that. Besides I'm sure Ken will be pushing him to go so that he doesn't have to risk lending the club his own money.

[BWFC_Insane]

I wondered this too but the squad make-up doesn't suit it. We've got a million wingers and although some could be squeezed in - Chungy at 10, Sammy off the front man, Morais at RWB, Buckley also an option at 10 - that would be to the detriment of Vela, allegedly a key man, and Little, one of our most impressive players. We've also only got three centre-backs (unless and until Burke returns) and none of them are what you'd call fast across the grass. And that's before you return to the reality of how easily teams at this level picked us off by passing in behind the wing-backs. I don't think it'd get us more clean sheets,quite the opposite: we might have the chance of scoring more but also conceding more.

I think the problem earlier in the season with 3-5-2 was the Cullen/Karacan midfield base. Teams were getting too much possession in areas where they could hurt us. Henry makes a massive difference. It worked at Sheffield United recently, though tbf Sheffield are struggling to score at home against most teams at the moment. I guess Little has more chance than Morais of being able to be a proper wing back who can get up and down and prevent us being exploited. Robinson on the other side is made for it. It would be a waste of all those wingers I agree. I am struggling to see us scoring in a 4-5-1 without Madine though. We already had stopped creating many chances, really since the Burton game. Since then we have scored 5 goals in 7 games, with Madine scoring 4 and creating the other.

3-5-2 simply doesn't work for us. We've found a system that works. We stick with that and find players to play in it.

Whatever way you dress it up, we need to sign 5 senior players today (not kids who've never played a real match) if we are to have a reasonable strength squad. Given we've lost Armstrong, Burke, Cullen, Madine (and Pratley to injury) thats the task. A bare minimum of 4 really. And frankly as much as I'd like him, Chungy doesn't really plug any holes so I'd say 4 + Chungy.

[bristol_Wanderer3]

3-5-2 simply doesn't work for us. We've found a system that works. We stick with that and find players to play in it.

I mean yes, but it isn't the system it is the players isn't it? When players change, then sometimes the system has to change also. That was highlighted with us last season. Only poor managers try and play a system when the players at their disposal don't suit it. Parky has proven himself adaptable thankfully. Right now, assuming Madine is going, I can't see how we can play 4-5-1? Wilbraham can't play 90 minutes each week, and there is no one else to play the striker role in a 4-5-1? And it is a big stretch for us to sign a striker good enough to do that role today without spending money?

[BWFC_Insane]

3-5-2 simply doesn't work for us. We've found a system that works. We stick with that and find players to play in it.

I mean yes, but it isn't the system it is the players isn't it? When players change, then sometimes the system has to change also. That was highlighted with us last season. Only poor managers try and play a system when the players at their disposal don't suit it. Parky has proven himself adaptable thankfully. Right now, assuming Madine is going, I can't see how we can play 4-5-1? Wilbraham can't play 90 minutes each week, and there is no one else to play the striker role in a 4-5-1? And it is a big stretch for us to sign a striker good enough to do that role today without spending money?

Thats why we're going down. But you don't collect wingers to play 3-5-2. That would be a nonsense.

[TANGODANCER]

Is it just remotely possible that a manager could consider a change of styles during a game rather tha before or after it? Just wondered....

[officer_dibble]

Not the one we have

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

I wondered this too but the squad make-up doesn't suit it. We've got a million wingers and although some could be squeezed in - Chungy at 10, Sammy off the front man, Morais at RWB, Buckley also an option at 10 - that would be to the detriment of Vela, allegedly a key man, and Little, one of our most impressive players. We've also only got three centre-backs (unless and until Burke returns) and none of them are what you'd call fast across the grass. And that's before you return to the reality of how easily teams at this level picked us off by passing in behind the wing-backs. I don't think it'd get us more clean sheets,quite the opposite: we might have the chance of scoring more but also conceding more.

I think the problem earlier in the season with 3-5-2 was the Cullen/Karacan midfield base. Teams were getting too much possession in areas where they could hurt us. Henry makes a massive difference. It worked at Sheffield United recently, though tbf Sheffield are struggling to score at home against most teams at the moment. I guess Little has more chance than Morais of being able to be a proper wing back who can get up and down and prevent us being exploited. Robinson on the other side is made for it. It would be a waste of all those wingers I agree. I am struggling to see us scoring in a 4-5-1 without Madine though. We already had stopped creating many chances, really since the Burton game. Since then we have scored 5 goals in 7 games, with Madine scoring 4 and creating the other.

I agree that Henry/Pratley is a much more solid central midfield than Cullen/Karacan, but that's another problem with switching from 4231 to 3-5-2. In the 4231 they can mind the shop and let the front four do the creativity thing, assisted by the overlapping full-backs. Put Henry/Pratley in front of a back three and you've suddenly got five blokes stood watching attacks peter out in the distance. Those two have excelled (arguably beyond our hopes) within a pretty narrow remit as a defensive double pivot, essentially defending a space the width of the penalty area and the length of our half; put them in a 3-5-2 and they'd need to be notably more fluid. Then there's the question of where Vela plays if not No.10 (though I admit there's the same quandary in a 4231).

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Is it just remotely possible that a manager could consider a change of styles during a game rather tha before or after it? Just wondered....

Owen Coyle often toggled from Reckless to Idiotic, usually by withdrawing Muamba for a forward...

TBH this is perhaps my biggest disappointment with Parky (notwithstanding the debatable but certainly real over-reliance on target-man football). He has proven himself impressively capable of switching systems in between games, and just about all the players have played in at least two formations, but he rarely seems able to switch to Plan B mid-game; his substitutions are often old-school decisions to throw more forwards at the problem, rather than reorganisations of the creative system that's going to feed them.

[BWFC_Insane]

Is it just remotely possible that a manager could consider a change of styles during a game rather tha before or after it? Just wondered....

Owen Coyle often toggled from Reckless to Idiotic, usually by withdrawing Muamba for a forward...

TBH this is perhaps my biggest disappointment with Parky (notwithstanding the debatable but certainly real over-reliance on target-man football). He has proven himself impressively capable of switching systems in between games, and just about all the players have played in at least two formations, but he rarely seems able to switch to Plan B mid-game; his substitutions are often old-school decisions to throw more forwards at the problem, rather than reorganisations of the creative system that's going to feed them.

Serious question, how many managers successfully change systems mid game? I suspect its an extremely rare occurrence and usually reserved for those with vast resources.

I think he makes changes too late sometimes and sometimes when hanging onto leads he doesn't freshen up in the right areas. But generally he's had so few options to bring on. Every sub we make is a downgrade.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Chatter updates:
• no confirmation of Madine deal - yet - despite 5th bid overnight
• the mooted £6m is a total including bonuses and would certainly not be all up front
• Cardiff loudly noting they'd be doubling Madine's wages
• Iles expects maybe three in, two out, but that's finger-in-air stuff
• Chungy deal very likely
• Michiel Kramer a possibility, lined up, but not iron-clad
• West Ham sources suggest Burke could come back but probably not Cullen
• Hammers might offer us 18yo winger Domingos Quina on loan (although I doubt he'd play much)
• less talk about Forest's Tyler Walker and Derby's James Hanson
• Reading close to loaning Derby's Chris Martin, a possible Madine replacement
• "a few" fringe players could leave, but probably not Hall or ALF unless/until more strikers are incoming
• talk of Rochdale asking about Wilbraham
• as ever, all this is very very much subject to change

[BWFC_Insane]

Chatter updates:
• no confirmation of Madine deal - yet - despite 5th bid overnight
• the mooted £6m is a total including bonuses and would certainly not be all up front
• Cardiff loudly noting they'd be doubling Madine's wages
• Iles expects maybe three in, two out, but that's finger-in-air stuff
• Chungy deal very likely
• Michiel Kramer a possibility, lined up, but not iron-clad
• West Ham sources suggest Burke could come back but probably not Cullen
• Hammers might offer us 18yo winger Domingos Quina on loan (although I doubt he'd play much)
• less talk about Forest's Tyler Walker and Derby's James Hanson
• Reading close to loaning Derby's Chris Martin, a possible Madine replacement
• "a few" fringe players could leave, but probably not Hall or ALF unless/until more strikers are incoming
• talk of Rochdale asking about Wilbraham
• as ever, all this is very very much subject to change

Lets hope that they at least have the common sense to hold off from dotting the i's and crossing the t's on Madine until we have actually completed a deal for a suitable replacement. If he goes then we can't get something across the line, that would be unforgivable in the extreme.