Ken Anderson - Old Owner (Definitely. For Ever ..... )

[malcd1]

Was Ken originally asking for £30m but the club will be debt free. In other words, Ken would settle all outstanding monies once the deal if finalised and he gets his grubby hands on the cash. Perhaps the wages will be paid out of this money as well.

[bristol_Wanderer3]

So Ken plays the brinksman until they blink.

I mean, I'm not condoning it. And he must be wondering, what if they don't blink? But here we are again.

What option does he have?

The whole equation will change very soon. Right now we are miraculously only four points off survival, and with a new manager bounce amidst an atmosphere of hope, we could get there and be only one Cardiff/Huddersfield type season from new owners hitting the jackpot.

In three weeks we will have played four more games, which realistically we must pick decent points up from, we will also be in court to be wound up, and be on the verge of not paying people for the second month. If Parky is still clinging on at that point, with morale surely on the floor, we could be facing certain L1 and be on the verge of admin. At that point the selling price almost certainly changes?

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Might be wrong, but seems to me that any unpaid bills regarding the day to day running of a business should be paid up to the time of actual signing unless agreed to the contrary? Owing wages is hardly the best start for new owners introduction. The sooner this is over the better it will be for everybody. I'm not normally suspicious, but.......

The business does not have the cash in the bank to pay wages....so you have as I see it two choices...business placed into admin (but who funds admin?) or the payment of wages is added to the deal with prospective new buyers who, one assumes don't want the business placed into admin or liquidated.....

So Ken plays the brinksman until they blink.

Well if you take the football emotion out of it...

A business is going bust - it enters into bailout talks with a buyer - talks progress to exclusivity periods - a deal is believed to be close.....the staff aren't paid their wages because the business has no cash in the bank....

What would happen? Usually the new owners would take on outstanding wages as part of the overall debt package when buying said business. If they did not want to...the deal would collapse...and business placed in administration or liquidated.

Should Ken himself pay the wages - he would only be loaning the money to Burnden Leisure - and consequently it would be a debt the new owners would have to take on for any deal. I see no way that this resolves positively without the new owners accepting a further debt and/or the amount being knocked off the deal price...(and KA taking a hit on the deal). The problem with the latter being it doesn't solve the lack of cash flow to pay wages in the short term....

So Ken plays the brinksman until they blink.

I mean, I'm not condoning it. And he must be wondering, what if they don't blink? But here we are again.

What option does he have?

Waiting until a grown-up foots the bill.

[BWFC_Insane]

Might be wrong, but seems to me that any unpaid bills regarding the day to day running of a business should be paid up to the time of actual signing unless agreed to the contrary? Owing wages is hardly the best start for new owners introduction. The sooner this is over the better it will be for everybody. I'm not normally suspicious, but.......

The business does not have the cash in the bank to pay wages....so you have as I see it two choices...business placed into admin (but who funds admin?) or the payment of wages is added to the deal with prospective new buyers who, one assumes don't want the business placed into admin or liquidated.....

So Ken plays the brinksman until they blink.

Well if you take the football emotion out of it...

A business is going bust - it enters into bailout talks with a buyer - talks progress to exclusivity periods - a deal is believed to be close.....the staff aren't paid their wages because the business has no cash in the bank....

What would happen? Usually the new owners would take on outstanding wages as part of the overall debt package when buying said business. If they did not want to...the deal would collapse...and business placed in administration or liquidated.

Should Ken himself pay the wages - he would only be loaning the money to Burnden Leisure - and consequently it would be a debt the new owners would have to take on for any deal. I see no way that this resolves positively without the new owners accepting a further debt and/or the amount being knocked off the deal price...(and KA taking a hit on the deal). The problem with the latter being it doesn't solve the lack of cash flow to pay wages in the short term....

So Ken plays the brinksman until they blink.

I mean, I'm not condoning it. And he must be wondering, what if they don't blink? But here we are again.

What option does he have?

Waiting until a grown-up foots the bill.

We've run out of money. I suspect we are at best a couple of weeks from admin or a takeover. I'm fairly sure Ken doesn't have the cash lying round to keep us going for the next two months and I'm even more sure if he did he wouldn't chuck it into a failing business.

I get that its a complete mess and Ken is to blame. But it isn't reasonable to expect him to cover the running costs - he never promised to do that and its clear now it would only delay the execution. IF he sells it then its a means to an end. If we hear that he's deliberately playing silly buggers with the sale and risking the future of the club (which I think is likely tbh), but if we hear that for sure then the pitchforks come out.

I'm not going to hang him for not paying wages when in theory he could sell the lot within the week, especially considering in reality few in his position and situation would do so.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Mate, I’m not quite sure what you’re saying. I get that he has no money. You seem sympathetic with him on that score. Then you say it’s “quite likely” that he’s playing silly buggers.

Well, whatever, we appear to be approaching some sort of end-game:

[BWFC_Insane]

Mate, I’m not quite sure what you’re saying. I get that he has no money. You seem sympathetic with him on that score. Then you say it’s “quite likely” that he’s playing silly buggers.

Well, whatever, we appear to be approaching some sort of end-game:

Yep - which I said a few months ago.

I think my only point is people who are saying "just pay the wages" as though it is that easy...the business has run out of road.

[Prufrock]

But it isn't reasonable to expect him to cover the running costs - he never promised to do that and its clear now it would only delay the execution.

Not having that. It might not be reasonable to expect him to cover the running costs, it fuxking is reasonable to expect him, as the guy in charge, not to have allowed those running costs to exceed the money coming in. The spiv cnut has run us on the never-never hoping to line his own pocket. It hardly makes him unique in football but that doesn't make it fine.

And yes, we were a shit show when he came in, but he took on that risk and, more importantly, I doubt there are many major outgoings now that haven't been renewed since he came in.

[BWFC_Insane]

But it isn't reasonable to expect him to cover the running costs - he never promised to do that and its clear now it would only delay the execution.

Not having that. It might not be reasonable to expect him to cover the running costs, it fuxking is reasonable to expect him, as the guy in charge, not to have allowed those running costs to exceed the money coming in. The spiv cnut has run us on the never-never hoping to line his own pocket. It hardly makes him unique in football but that doesn't make it fine.

And yes, we were a shit show when he came in, but he took on that risk and, more importantly, I doubt there are many major outgoings now that haven't been renewed since he came in.

Indeed. I don't disagree with that. I guess the trouble is that when you've shaved so much off the wage bill and cut so many costs and still you're losing £3M a year its not that easy to stay under the line.

The trouble is he's done what PG did and just tried to pretend everything was ok until the point it was clear it wasn't and left the club up against the wall gun to the head.....

[dave the minion]

Controversial as this may be, but without a takeover, could anyone have done anything different than KA has done, or any better? From what I can tell (which probably isn't the full story of course) he's done quite a good job of cutting costs and getting us out of onerous contracts, so the club is probably on a better footing than it might have been otherwise?

Who's to say another chairman who, without the funds to pump into the club, could have found a buyer sooner? I admit that the way he's gone about some of the things leaves a little to be desired, but I struggle to see what other options were on the table?

[Lost Leopard Spot]

I'm wondering for all those emergent entrepreneurs out there (and the established money investors like the state Norwegian Pension Fund) whether the surfeit of available cheap rate failing football clubs is distorting the market. I mean, on one hand you can have a really cheap, historically oldest, football club with a ground free of mortgage and debts but liable to flood; or get a modern desirable accomodation, but ownership complicated, venue, with local history, and comparably high wage bill including the only vicar on a pay roll.

Not being foreign, or rich, I can hardly be qualified to determine, but I reckon I'd make more outta Notts County than I would BWFC.

[BWFC_Insane]

I'm wondering for all those emergent entrepreneurs out there (and the established money investors like the state Norwegian Pension Fund) whether the surfeit of available cheap rate failing football clubs is distorting the market. I mean, on one hand you can have a really cheap, historically oldest, football club with a ground free of mortgage and debts but liable to flood; or get a modern desirable accomodation, but ownership complicated, venue, with local history, and comparably high wage bill including the only vicar on a pay roll.

Not being foreign, or rich, I can hardly be qualified to determine, but I reckon I'd make more outta Notts County than I would BWFC.

Well we've seemingly found a buyer....

Ken might be in the process of scaring them away though. I suspect buying a football club from someone who isn't an absolute *insert rude word* might be easier....

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Ken email to staff asks for patience. Surprised he didn't add "and a few bob wouldn't go amiss".

https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/sport/1 ... -salaries/

[BWFC_Insane]

Ken email to staff asks for patience. Surprised he didn't add "and a few bob wouldn't go amiss".

https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/sport/1 ... -salaries/

Takeover in danger of collapse now it seems. Ken threatening to "talk with 2 other parties" not helping but I do wonder what due diligence may have thrown up. We know we're a basket case and I suspect we only know a fraction of it....once someone starts digging....oh lordy....

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Takeover in danger of collapse now it seems.

Well, let's see. They've walked away once and walked back right up. Jesus, I hope they don't walk away again.

[Lost Leopard Spot]

Ken email to staff asks for patience. Surprised he didn't add "and a few bob wouldn't go amiss".

https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/sport/1 ... -salaries/

Takeover in danger of collapse now it seems. Ken threatening to "talk with 2 other parties" not helping but I do wonder what due diligence may have thrown up. We know we're a basket case and I suspect we only know a fraction of it....once someone starts digging....oh lordy....

Ten seconds ago you were throwing out the line "well we've seemingly we've found a buyer, nyah nyah na na nyer..."

[BWFC_Insane]

Ken email to staff asks for patience. Surprised he didn't add "and a few bob wouldn't go amiss".

https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/sport/1 ... -salaries/

Takeover in danger of collapse now it seems. Ken threatening to "talk with 2 other parties" not helping but I do wonder what due diligence may have thrown up. We know we're a basket case and I suspect we only know a fraction of it....once someone starts digging....oh lordy....

Ten seconds ago you were throwing out the line "well we've seemingly we've found a buyer, nyah nyah na na nyer..."

We have. They agreed terms in principle....what lurks beneath though? Also I fear Ken's brinkmanship would put any right minded person off.

[Lost Leopard Spot]

What I'm pointing out is your cakeism.

[BWFC_Insane]

What I'm pointing out is your cakeism.

You know how you were adamant a month ago that I was wrong and that it wasn't either a takeover or admin and that Ken could "muddle through indefinitely"?

Do you want to re-think that?

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

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[bristol_Wanderer3]

Controversial as this may be, but without a takeover, could anyone have done anything different than KA has done, or any better? From what I can tell (which probably isn't the full story of course) he's done quite a good job of cutting costs and getting us out of onerous contracts, so the club is probably on a better footing than it might have been otherwise?

Who's to say another chairman who, without the funds to pump into the club, could have found a buyer sooner? I admit that the way he's gone about some of the things leaves a little to be desired, but I struggle to see what other options were on the table?

IF, if, we were to complete a successful takeover in the next few days, I could see this from both sides. I would probably still come down on the side that you could have our 10k ST holders contribute £200 each to create a £2m fund to temporarily cover cash shortfalls and so pay the wages, nominate someone sensible to run the club and we would not have had the ridiculousness of the last six months in particular and still be in a no worse position, whilst not having our reputation trashed. I wonder how much money we waste going through the winding up order process every month?

My big concern is around Ken's history and character which ominously involves dishonesty around businesses going to liquidation, combined with this latest news which suggests he is screwing around with the takeover, threatening to re-open negotiations with other parties, all in the same correspondence as telling staff they aren't getting paid whilst the process continues.

https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/news/17 ... -salaries/