2024, hoodwink and bamboozle the public

[Worthy4England]

Certainly a bit of a different reaction to that weirdo with a crossbow who killed the BBC fella's family. Saw very few posts trying to organise a riot, no "Rule Britannia," being sung in the streets. Just an unfortunate event.

[BWFC_Insane]

Certainly a bit of a different reaction to that weirdo with a crossbow who killed the BBC fella's family. Saw very few posts trying to organise a riot, no "Rule Britannia," being sung in the streets. Just an unfortunate event.

Presumably he only did it because there are Muslims in this country and he was rightly ‘angry about that’. But like you know being very angry about young girls being murdered by a person born in this country means you are compelled to go up to those people’s houses rip their walls and gardens apart and fight the police. It’s only fair. Oh and attack a mosque. Even if you aren’t sure if a Muslim is involved just attack one to be safe.

[Prufrock]

Particular low light is the mother of one of the dead kids having to publicly ask the feck* not to riot. I think she's got enough on her plate.

On the flip side there were some very touching pictures and stories of the community coming together turning out to help rebuild the damage to the mosque and other areas trashed. Tradesman doing it for free, Joe Public pitching in. Reminds you those divs are not representative.

And I must have watched this a hundred times

[malcd1]

Certainly a bit of a different reaction to that weirdo with a crossbow who killed the BBC fella's family. Saw very few posts trying to organise a riot, no "Rule Britannia," being sung in the streets. Just an unfortunate event.

I am not defending anyone but there is a difference between the crossbow maniac, who murdered his ex-girlfriend and family and a maniac who has deliberately targeted young children who are complete strangers, whether or not it was due to religion or the colour of their skin.

Both are abhorrent to the family of those deceased but similar to the Manchester Arena bomber, the ones that indiscriminately target innocent young children need a very slow painful death. All are horrible but I am still saying some are worse than others.

I am also not defending those that are rioting who are mainly brainless idiots. Attacking the police in the way they did is ludicrous no matter how angry they think they are.

[Worthy4England]

I don't generally see a difference. They're both maniacs.

[malcd1]

I don't generally see a difference. They're both maniacs.

We agree on that.

[Hoboh]

No matter who riots or causes disturbance, they should all be dealt with the same way, but I notice Starmer wants the 'far right' treated like football hooligans but fails to mention those in Leeds?
Water cannons and batons, the French, Spanish and Italians get some things right.

[Worthy4England]

So when the PMs office and the Home Sec said about Leeds, that the perps should be dealt with by the full force of the law, we just ignore that bit?

[Worthy4England]

And whilst we're about it, maybe you could explain why Tommy hasn't requested mass deportations of "the Irish" who were still bombing our mainland in the 90's? Is that because our English patriot had an Irish mother, which by his calculations makes him a fcking immigrant...

[BWFC_Insane]

So when the PMs office and the Home Sec said about Leeds, that the perps should be dealt with by the full force of the law, we just ignore that bit?

Aye they are just ignoring anything that doesn’t suit their agenda.

[Worthy4England]

I do agree with Hobes that disturbances/riots should be dealt with in the same manner irrespective, I saw the same sort of tw@ts at both. I'm delighted at his shining example of how we should adopt European practices..

[boltonboris]

And whilst we're about it, maybe you could explain why Tommy hasn't requested mass deportations of "the Irish" who were still bombing our mainland in the 90's? Is that because our English patriot had an Irish mother, which by his calculations makes him a fcking immigrant...

Yaxley Lennon has an Irish passport so he doesn't have to queue with the scruffs at Alicante airport

[TANGODANCER]

Apropos of very little:

I'm sure that if it cost nothing to keep criminals locked up, there would be very little crime. Like all else these days, finance is the first consideration. Maybe all the members of Parliament should automatically donate half of their annual ill-gotten gains to fighting crime? Dispense with all the grace and favour inherited titles and land grants that went out of use and fashion with The Crusaders, and whilst not quite advocating a bread and water, Count of Monte Christo regime, stop making prisons a Billy Butlins rest home for society's non-conformists. It's supposedly a deterrent, not a better life than a lot of inmates already have. (That might also not make England so much the Land of Dreams, benefits and free health care that it is). Right now, spending a lifetime by the rules, in employment and paying tax and insurance equates with living off benefits and "Land of the Free" more an English
title than an American song of praise.

No real use making the current government a "Sins of the fathers" victim, but they need to show some intent to make the population believe things will change for the better. Ask me not how that might be achieved, but one can hope.

[BWFC_Insane]

Apropos of very little:

I'm sure that if it cost nothing to keep criminals locked up, there would be very little crime. Like all else these days, finance is the first consideration. Maybe all the members of Parliament should automatically donate half of their annual ill-gotten gains to fighting crime? Dispense with all the grace and favour inherited titles and land grants that went out of use and fashion with The Crusaders, and whilst not quite advocating a bread and water, Count of Monte Christo regime, stop making prisons a Billy Butlins rest home for society's non-conformists. It's supposedly a deterrent, not a better life than a lot of inmates already have. (That might also not make England so much the Land of Dreams, benefits and free health care that it is). Right now, spending a lifetime by the rules, in employment and paying tax and insurance equates with living off benefits and "Land of the Free" more an English
title than an American song of praise.

No real use making the current government a "Sins of the fathers" victim, but they need to show some intent to make the population believe things will change for the better. Ask me not how that might be achieved, but one can hope.

They still execute folk in parts of the USA - and it doesn’t act as a deterrent so I’m not sure why making prisons less nice would either.

Especially in relation to a lot of the crime we are seeing or the high profile stuff which does not seem to be about a lack of deterrent.

We have a prisons shortage - but there is actually money to build more prisons in the budget but the last government didn’t because nobody wants a new prison in their constituency. I do agree we need to build more and we need more efficient designs because the prison pressures are absolutely dreadful.

[TANGODANCER]

We have a prisons shortage - but there is actually money to build more prisons in the budget but the last government didn’t because nobody wants a new prison in their constituency. I do agree we need to build more and we need more efficient designs because the prison pressures are absolutely dreadful.

Building prisons is a contract for some corporation or other. That's industry. The cost of keeping the inmates is an entirely different bowl of porridge altogether.

[Worthy4England]

We have a prisons shortage - but there is actually money to build more prisons in the budget but the last government didn’t because nobody wants a new prison in their constituency. I do agree we need to build more and we need more efficient designs because the prison pressures are absolutely dreadful.

Building prisons is a contract for some corporation or other. That's industry. The cost of keeping the inmates is an entirely different bowl of porridge altogether.

I think the point was "to keep people locked up" - in your no crime scenario - they'd have to have more cells to keep them in - you can't have one without the other.

[TANGODANCER]

I think the point was "to keep people locked up" - in your no crime scenario - they'd have to have more cells to keep them in - you can't have one without the other.
[/quote]

My point was actually to stop criminals offending by desire because incarceration is seen by them as somewhat a soft option with three square a day, exercise, T.V and availability of drugs etc.

[BWFC_Insane]

I think the point was "to keep people locked up" - in your no crime scenario - they'd have to have more cells to keep them in - you can't have one without the other.

My point was actually to stop criminals offending by desire because incarceration is seen by them as somewhat a soft option with three square a day, exercise, T.V and availability of drugs etc.
[/quote]

But that’s not why people offend. Deterrence, no matter how harsh doesn’t seem to have a big impact on crime rates.

[Hoboh]

So when the PMs office and the Home Sec said about Leeds, that the perps should be dealt with by the full force of the law, we just ignore that bit?

Erm, I think you'll find they were talking about getting to the cause of the disturbance and working with the community, but that's besides the point. Tear gas, rubber bullets, water cannon and cosh should be used there and in the current situation, go in hard!
Oh and it seems from what I've seen on TV a certain group of people almost have a paramilitary dress code with hoods and masks, make that unlawful as well.

[Hoboh]

I think the point was "to keep people locked up" - in your no crime scenario - they'd have to have more cells to keep them in - you can't have one without the other.

My point was actually to stop criminals offending by desire because incarceration is seen by them as somewhat a soft option with three square a day, exercise, T.V and availability of drugs etc.

You hang a murderer, he kills no one else.

You chop off persistent shop lifter and theives hands, they stop

You let prisoners mingle with each other, have sex and phones in their cells alongside drugs taking, treat them to learning other crims methods and what do you get?

Nobody gives a sh*t if they get caught because the penalty is less than the reward if you don't get caught.

But that’s not why people offend. Deterrence, no matter how harsh doesn’t seem to have a big impact on crime rates.
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