Down in The Valley, something stirred. V Charlton Athletic away Sat Aug 24th 3-0 'clock.

[GhostoftheBok]

I don't even see that at the moment.

I do, but I can't be arsed today. I found that game genuinely painful.

I'm not sure how he's gone to this system without a proper #10 to make things happen. That's what really confuses me no end.

I like McAtee and Collins, but they're not that player. They'll suit a lot of games, but in others we will create sod all.

Changing to a system that often needs a player you don't have is weird, to be honest. It's like we've created the ideal system for Paris and forgotten he's left.

[DJBlu]

We're all panic fannies by the way.

No, it's right to say today was abysmal.

They all deserve all they get after that. Not an acceptable performance.

Two foul throws? THREE players making the same run at the same time? Failure to make the most basic passes in the game?

Sod 'em. You can't play like that. It's not like it's a bunch of young players.

Be that it may but there are 43 more games to come.

As there were last season and the season before. And nothing has changed.

And in everyone we've finished higher than the one before. Fact.

Ian Evatt will not be here in a month or so as he's not going to get the time a new manager would. People are already saying "Lose this and he's got to go". Imagine working under that pressure? Always on your final warning.

Charlton had to be gifted possession to score, they didn't have much of a threat, that's partly down to the defence. I'll admit the midfield is always light with Josh Sheehan but when he's on it he dictates play. The top 3 are going to need time to work out when to go and when to pass. That was so evident today. There was some seriously good passages of play when we moved it about however as every player had concrete boots on we lost it when it mattered most. For every player to not turn up is extremely rare which I hope it's a one off and not any sort of unrest.

As a side note, We've not lost to Charlton in a long time. They're having a good start and we were due a loss there sooner or later.

I know people don't like it but they will have learned a shed loads about themselves and each other today.

[GhostoftheBok]

Blub from Evatt after the game.

"Work harder", "get better", "I believe in them" etc etc.

Not sure he could have said anything to make me less annoyed, but he didn't really say anything at all.

He's right that the players abandoned the structure, especially in wide areas. Whether that's a familiarity issues or the players not trusting the system remains to be seen.

For the first time ever my kid has declined to listen to the post match. Says it all as to how off-putting that performance was.

[officer_dibble]

I’ve watched three games, against three very different teams with this line up. I’m at a loss at the moment to see what it does for Josh Sheehan I really am.

If the plans to get him out of the side I get it - he’s given up on Morley, maybe Sheehan is the next one. I’d of sold him this summer if my plan was to play this way.

[BWFC_Insane]

We're all panic fannies by the way.

No, it's right to say today was abysmal.

They all deserve all they get after that. Not an acceptable performance.

Two foul throws? THREE players making the same run at the same time? Failure to make the most basic passes in the game?

Sod 'em. You can't play like that. It's not like it's a bunch of young players.

Be that it may but there are 43 more games to come.

As there were last season and the season before. And nothing has changed.

And in everyone we've finished higher than the one before. Fact.

Ian Evatt will not be here in a month or so as he's not going to get the time a new manager would. People are already saying "Lose this and he's got to go". Imagine working under that pressure? Always on your final warning.

Charlton had to be gifted possession to score, they didn't have much of a threat, that's partly down to the defence. I'll admit the midfield is always light with Josh Sheehan but when he's on it he dictates play. The top 3 are going to need time to work out when to go and when to pass. That was so evident today. There was some seriously good passages of play when we moved it about however as every player had concrete boots on we lost it when it mattered most. For every player to not turn up is extremely rare which I hope it's a one off and not any sort of unrest.

As a side note, We've not lost to Charlton in a long time. They're having a good start and we were due a loss there sooner or later.

I know people don't like it but they will have learned a shed loads about themselves and each other today.

Pressure? Evatt has had no pressure. That’s the problem. He’s coasted had an easy ride. And consequently allowed the players to coast. It’s never been a less demanding environment.

We’ve just had two seasons end in failure and started this poorly. He shouldn’t be here let alone have people saying ‘he’s under pressure’. I think if we had a more experienced chairperson they’d have applied genuine pressure much earlier. It’s all far too soft.

Santos should be publically called out. But isn’t. Imagine Bergson or Davies doing that rubbish?

[GhostoftheBok]

And in everyone we've finished higher than the one before. Fact.

Yes and today we had so many openings where the final pass was wrong and so we didn't get a shot off.

That's not a system issue, it's the players not getting the details right - as Evatt likes to put it.

People obsess over systems and numbers, but all they do is act as platforms. They put individuals into roles and space and then ask them to play football.

Today we played bad, bad football. Foul throws, crap passes, running into each other...the works.

Part of that was tactical, with the wingbacks failing to provide width and the #10s apparently having never met or knowing where they should be. Loads of it was the players' brains staying on the bus.

"The system" isn't crap. Just like the 4-3-3 wasn't crap when we played that.

We have been better every season under Evatt, I agree. Not so far this season, though, early days as it is. It's been a fairly shoddy start and today kicks the hope we were gradually improving right in the knackers.

[officer_dibble]

Mike Duffs Huddersfield 14th September - that’s where I think it will kick off in the stands.

I mean it might against Exeter but you can see the 0-1 defeat against a Mike Duff team coming a mile off.

[jmjhb]

Mike Duffs Huddersfield 14th September - that’s where I think it will kick off in the stands.

I mean it might against Exeter but you can see the 0-1 defeat against a Mike Duff team coming a mile off.

Duff is someone I wanted in after the playoff debacle.

[BWFC_Insane]

And in everyone we've finished higher than the one before. Fact.

Yes and today we had so many openings where the final pass was wrong and so we didn't get a shot off.

That's not a system issue, it's the players not getting the details right - as Evatt likes to put it.

People obsess over systems and numbers, but all they do is act as platforms. They put individuals into roles and space and then ask them to play football.

Today we played bad, bad football. Foul throws, crap passes, running into each other...the works.

Part of that was tactical, with the wingbacks failing to provide width and the #10s apparently having never met or knowing where they should be. Loads of it was the players' brains staying on the bus.

"The system" isn't crap. Just like the 4-3-3 wasn't crap when we played that.

We have been better every season under Evatt, I agree. Not so far this season, though, early days as it is. It's been a fairly shoddy start and today kicks the hope we were gradually improving right in the knackers.

The system is crap. Sorry it just is. Players don’t get details right when they aren’t playing in areas they can do best in and when it isn’t clicking.

But three at the back has to be abandoned. It doesn’t work.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Mike Duffs Huddersfield 14th September - that’s where I think it will kick off in the stands.

I mean it might against Exeter but you can see the 0-1 defeat against a Mike Duff team coming a mile off.

Aye, it's very feasible. As I say the three games before the international break are winnable - so the ceiling may not collapse, even if there's a leak in the loft. But Huddersfield - roses clash, at home, big away following, well-organised team rope-a-doping us - yeah, that could very believably be a 0-1 and howls of anguish.

[Bertie Wooster]

Not the only one by any stretch but another poor performance from Sheehan, I really don't know what his role is in this team / formation and I'm not sure that he does. Also, Collins who's a very talented player seems very half hearted and never seems to get out of 2nd gear.

As with last season something is amiss in regards to the mentality in this team.

[GhostoftheBok]

Sheehan got absolute shafted by the ref today. I'm not arguing around his performance, they were all crap (I may leave Johnston out of that), but feck me did they smash Sheehan and get away with it time and again.

We decided to try and same with their lads and it was consistently given as a foul, despite the fouls being much lighter. The ref just decided you can't foul Sheehan. Which is happening in most games now.

I do understand why Evatt is so frustrated with reffing around Josh.

[DJBlu]

Sheehan is 4 stone piss wet through and has to jump to ride the challenges, in doing so it looks like he's diving. All it takes is studs up once in a while and let em know you're not fecking about. He won't do that and we look like whiney bastards complaining.

[nicholaldo]

Quite apart from anything else, I very often find us boring to watch.

And if it isn't boring, it's frustrating.

[BWFC_Insane]

Sheehan got absolute shafted by the ref today. I'm not arguing around his performance, they were all crap (I may leave Johnston out of that), but feck me did they smash Sheehan and get away with it time and again.

We decided to try and same with their lads and it was consistently given as a foul, despite the fouls being much lighter. The ref just decided you can't foul Sheehan. Which is happening in most games now.

I do understand why Evatt is so frustrated with reffing around Josh.

Sheehan is weak as piss and a shirked at Wembley and in other big games.

This is a tough league and we need players who are robust enough and mentally strong enough to deal with it. He’s a luxury and we shouldn’t be carrying him.

I’m sick of excuses. He’s not up to doing the job we need and referees are what they are down here. It’s been a physically demanding grafting league with poor refs since we entered. Since forever. Deal with it.

[GhostoftheBok]

Sheehan is weak as piss and a shirked at Wembley and in other big games.

This is a tough league and we need players who are robust enough and mentally strong enough to deal with it. He’s a luxury and we shouldn’t be carrying him.

I’m sick of excuses. He’s not up to doing the job we need and referees are what they are down here. It’s been a physically demanding grafting league with poor refs since we entered. Since forever. Deal with it.

Bollocks, lad.

He won the awards he did last season for a reason. He was the most consistent and best player in the side.

How can our most consistent player be a "luxury"? Absolute, unadulterated nonsense.

[BWFC_Insane]

Sheehan is weak as piss and a shirked at Wembley and in other big games.

This is a tough league and we need players who are robust enough and mentally strong enough to deal with it. He’s a luxury and we shouldn’t be carrying him.

I’m sick of excuses. He’s not up to doing the job we need and referees are what they are down here. It’s been a physically demanding grafting league with poor refs since we entered. Since forever. Deal with it.

Bollocks, lad.

He won the awards he did last season for a reason. He was the most consistent and best player in the side.

How can our most consistent player be a "luxury"? Absolute, unadulterated nonsense.

He won awards. Great. He didn’t turn up when it really mattered and is bullied out of games. He’s a luxury. Overrated. We treat him like he’s Barry bannan yet he’s half the player at best.

Sorry he’s symptomatic of everything we are that I despise. Soft, flat track bullies without any physical or mental spine. When the going gets tough blame the referees, pitches or opposition.

When we struggle when does Sheehan ever get a grip of the game. When does he ever turn it round through sheer graft and drive? Never is the answer. And just like with Evatt and xG nonsense all the awards in the world won’t change my view. You won’t get out of this league carrying him - and he doesn’t do enough when it really matters to warrant being carried

[Bertie Wooster]

Quite apart from anything else, I very often find us boring to watch.

And if it isn't boring, it's frustrating.

Yes totally agree, quite a few 2nd half last week said the same.

Everything is just so slow, lethargic & predictable. I've seen somewhere this evening that its now 5 wins in the last 15 games which isn't surprising when you watch the way we play.

[The_Gun]

Sheehan is weak as piss and a shirked at Wembley and in other big games.

This is a tough league and we need players who are robust enough and mentally strong enough to deal with it. He’s a luxury and we shouldn’t be carrying him.

I’m sick of excuses. He’s not up to doing the job we need and referees are what they are down here. It’s been a physically demanding grafting league with poor refs since we entered. Since forever. Deal with it.

Bollocks, lad.

He won the awards he did last season for a reason. He was the most consistent and best player in the side.

How can our most consistent player be a "luxury"? Absolute, unadulterated nonsense.

He won awards. Great. He didn’t turn up when it really mattered and is bullied out of games. He’s a luxury. Overrated. We treat him like he’s Barry bannan yet he’s half the player at best.

Sorry he’s symptomatic of everything we are that I despise. Soft, flat track bullies without any physical or mental spine. When the going gets tough blame the referees, pitches or opposition.

When we struggle when does Sheehan ever get a grip of the game. When does he ever turn it round through sheer graft and drive? Never is the answer. And just like with Evatt and xG nonsense all the awards in the world won’t change my view. You won’t get out of this league carrying him - and he doesn’t do enough when it really matters to warrant being carried

You constantly falling back on supposed physical deficiencies undermines your arguments, for me. If you look at our team today I don’t think you could justifiably call it small or soft. Lacking pace maybe, but in my opinion our failings are largely tactical.

[Bertie Wooster]

Bollocks, lad.

He won the awards he did last season for a reason. He was the most consistent and best player in the side.

How can our most consistent player be a "luxury"? Absolute, unadulterated nonsense.

I'm absolutely baffled how he won the awards as watching him live most of last season, he only showed up in a handful of games.

You need to be streetwise and tough in this league and unfortunately we are neither, and our pound shop Pep manager thinks we can get promoted by playing tippy tappy pass till you drop, low intensity, slow as feck, bore the fans to sleep football,

We need someone in asap with fresh ideas and a different way of playing, I think a few are now a bit fed up of the football being served up week after week, its becoming consistently a bit shite regardless of the players brought in.