Between the lines. Home to Reading, Sat 21st Sept/ 3'oclock.

[Worthy4England]

I did say there weren't many in L1 Y1! I think our manager did mention we had the best team in the League, if I've got my years right!

By L1 Y3, I'm struggling. Especially on "exciting football." Lots of goals against some whipping boys isn't my idea of it, and I'm pretty sure it would involve the words heading and tackling with rather more frequency. There are IMO increasing levels of volume around shit possession based football that is infesting the game. Even my City mates complain about it (whilst still enjoying the pot collecting)...

At that point, he's not got us up and to my mind there's little exciting about watching a low block keep out 70% posession for 80 minutes. I'd rather watch 50/50 and 2-0.

[Prufrock]

He did, but he's a gobshite. We clearly weren't and I'm not going to judge him on it. For the same reason he wouldn't get a pass now if he tried to argue we're only a bottom 4 team.

As for exciting, well it's taste and fancy, but if that's not for you (as you say, a not uncommon view on "modern football") well it's going to be diminishing returns on football in general now I fear! Whatever you might say about it, it's successful. So more are going to do it.

I enjoyed that year! That plus the second half of Y1 the most I've enjoyed watching a Bolton team since Sam

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Nodding along in agreement at Pru's assessments there.

I like the type of football we try to play – not always the way it comes out, but the intentions. While I understand (if not agree with) the backlash against possession, it sometimes seems to get forgotten that if you're not in possession the opposition are. I'd say just about all the good times I've ever had at football games have been when my side's had the ball. (When possession football doesn't work, it's admittedly boring – but when non-possession football doesn't work, you're just surrendering your agency.)

Anyway, on Evatt. I wanted to believe and for a long time I did. We've had problems in every season and usually overcome them. and there has definitely been progression over the seasons. However, I've now lost faith that we can solve problems as they arise, and furthermore I have grown increasingly fearful that teams can quickly suss us out and we have no in-game flexibility to respond and overcome them.

That's a pity because I think Evatt could be a very good manager. He clearly cares a lot, wants to play modern football, and comesd up with long-term strategies. I fear for him (and therefore currently us!) that he's too prescriptive; he might benefit if he could simplify the deep-content stuff a little, rehearse more than one formation and give players more free rein.

But I do think he should leave now, as damage limitation for both the club and his reputation. (If he jumps now he can pretend it was an early-season blip and an itchy-trigger board. If it drags on to October, November it's clearly not.) The chances of him fixing it feel much lower the than chances of it getting worse and therefore affecting our hopes of promotion.

[Frank Drebin]

Sad to say, but for the first time since the dark days of 2019 I’m not looking forward to attending.

Come on Frank, pick yourself up, dust yourself off and get back to the positive. Bolton are tougher then that, we just have to scrap a bit harder.

Cheers Tango, No doubt when I wake up Saturday the optimism will be back. I’m sure the crowd will be right behind them from the off and if we score first (we must be due) then everyone’s confidence will be up and the players should get a lift. If we concede first though…
The first goal on Saturday will dictate the afternoon.

[Frank Drebin]

Sad to say, but for the first time since the dark days of 2019 I’m not looking forward to attending.

Come on Frank, pick yourself up, dust yourself off and get back to the positive. Bolton are tougher then that, we just have to scrap a bit harder.

Cheers Tango, No doubt when I wake up Saturday the optimism will be back. I’m sure the crowd will be right behind them from the off and if we score first (we must be due) then everyone’s confidence will be up and the players should get a lift. If we concede first though…
The first goal on Saturday will dictate the afternoon.

[Worthy4England]

He did, but he's a gobshite. We clearly weren't and I'm not going to judge him on it. For the same reason he wouldn't get a pass now if he tried to argue we're only a bottom 4 team.

As for exciting, well it's taste and fancy, but if that's not for you (as you say, a not uncommon view on "modern football") well it's going to be diminishing returns on football in general now I fear! Whatever you might say about it, it's successful. So more are going to do it.

I enjoyed that year! That plus the second half of Y1 the most I've enjoyed watching a Bolton team since Sam

There will come a point, when "the new best way to counter possession football," comes about. Not like we didn't see similar in the 80's in Italian football, which the media wanted to bill at "This is the way..."

Whatever I might say about it being successful, it wasn't quite as successful as Oxford or Pompey or Derby all of whom had lower posession than us nor Peterborough who had more, the thing that makes it successful or otherwise is results, not the possession stat.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

the thing that makes it successful or otherwise is results, not the possession stat.

Well that solves that mystery - I was wondering why the league table stacked up like that!

[Worthy4England]

the thing that makes it successful or otherwise is results, not the possession stat.

Well that solves that mystery - I was wondering why the league table stacked up like that!

You and a few others including our gaffer, methinks! TBF it's little different than "if we don't have the ball, they do," which it was suggested some folks might forget. Touche.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Fair, but I think some do forget, and seem to think that Getting It Up The Pitch helps the entertainment. It happened on Saturday - boos when the ball went back to Baxter ("Get it forward!"), quickly seguing into more boos when he did so and their centre-back briefly stopped sucking on his cigar to tower over Dion.

Winning always trumps losing, obvz, but losing with 27% possession feels much more soul-destroying to me than losing with 60% or whatever. As I've said, those last two seasons under Parky, where we basically cowered and winced and were rarely in control of our own destiny, were far harder for me to watch than the mild frustration of not breaking down a low block.

And to bring it bang up to date, watching us this Saturday gormlessly knock it long to yon centre-back was much worse than watching us try to pass through them. Neither's great.

[Worthy4England]

When did anyone suggest "let's have 27% posession?" I know we're in the age where we have to write "hot" on cups of coffee but I shouldn't have to fcuking add "to a White shirt" to "Get it forwards"

I quite like passing. So I'll change it up to (Get it forwards with some intent and pace to one of our players, preferably one with enough time to move it to the next fella further forwards. Oh and mind that coffee, it's hot) I'll shout that in future.

[BWFC_Insane]

Fair, but I think some do forget, and seem to think that Getting It Up The Pitch helps the entertainment. It happened on Saturday - boos when the ball went back to Baxter ("Get it forward!"), quickly seguing into more boos when he did so and their centre-back briefly stopped sucking on his cigar to tower over Dion.

Winning always trumps losing, obvz, but losing with 27% possession feels much more soul-destroying to me than losing with 60% or whatever. As I've said, those last two seasons under Parky, where we basically cowered and winced and were rarely in control of our own destiny, were far harder for me to watch than the mild frustration of not breaking down a low block.

And to bring it bang up to date, watching us this Saturday gormlessly knock it long to yon centre-back was much worse than watching us try to pass through them. Neither's great.

Couldn’t disagree more with this. The most attractive side Parky had was the first one with Ameobi, Clough, Vela. All supporting a striker, with fluidity and all able to drive forwards in their own way. Ameobi and Clough were exciting to watch and Vela looked like scoring goals from all over. It was a good brand of football that wasn’t about stringing 60% possession together through sideways passes.

He now with Wrexham has one of if not the highest win percentages in the league and plays football that is far preferable to what we do. We can all argue about our capability at the time for the championship but Evatt’s drivel that you play this way to ensure you are better equipped when you go up is so utterly laughable it’s beyond belief he would even have tried that one.

I don’t care if we pump it at a target man or don’t. What we absolutely need to do is get up the pitch far quicker and when we do deliver balls into the danger area.

As it stands we make teams defend very little they watch us pass in front of them. We have no counter punch. No pace. And no players who come close to generating excitement like Ameobi and Clough could. Nor do we have a midfield player who can score goals the like of which vela did.

We pass the ball sideways and backwards and the crowd have rightly had enough of it. Goals are scored more often the fewer touches you take. That’s a fact. We take so many touches and let teams get set and have absolutely no drive or intensity in our attacks.

Creating chances and forcing teams on the back foot and making them defend is what excites a Bolton crowd and how we play under Evatt has rarely managed to do that.

[Worthy4England]

^^ So you're not advocating "Just hoof it!" Either? I'm wondering where the just hoof it contingent actually are, other than in people's heads....

I thought Rotherham played decent football when they went up (<50% possession), I also thought Ipswich did ~60% possession. I can forgive 15 crosses we miss by a whisker easier than 10 passes from Santos to Toal to Sheehan to Santos to Baxter to Santos to "big hopeful diagonal" that their defence have just waited patiently for.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

I'm just about beginning to get the scintilla of the iota of a whiff of an idea that we won't agree on this

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Fair, but I think some do forget, and seem to think that Getting It Up The Pitch helps the entertainment. It happened on Saturday - boos when the ball went back to Baxter ("Get it forward!"), quickly seguing into more boos when he did so and their centre-back briefly stopped sucking on his cigar to tower over Dion.

Winning always trumps losing, obvz, but losing with 27% possession feels much more soul-destroying to me than losing with 60% or whatever. As I've said, those last two seasons under Parky, where we basically cowered and winced and were rarely in control of our own destiny, were far harder for me to watch than the mild frustration of not breaking down a low block.

And to bring it bang up to date, watching us this Saturday gormlessly knock it long to yon centre-back was much worse than watching us try to pass through them. Neither's great.

Couldn’t disagree more with this.

Couldn't care less.

[Prufrock]

^^ So you're not advocating "Just hoof it!" Either? I'm wondering where the just hoof it contingent actually are, other than in people's heads....

I thought Rotherham played decent football when they went up (<50% possession), I also thought Ipswich did ~60% possession. I can forgive 15 crosses we miss by a whisker easier than 10 passes from Santos to Toal to Sheehan to Santos to Baxter to Santos to "big hopeful diagonal" that their defence have just waited patiently for.

Interestingly (or not) I had the symmetrical thought reading you and BWFC-I - who exactly are all these "keep possession for the sake of possession" people?

[Worthy4England]

I'm just about beginning to get the scintilla of the iota of a whiff of an idea that we won't agree on this

I think there's plenty of space in the middle, when moving from the poles. Not liking possession football for possessions sake doesn't mean so lets go see what's available at the diametric opposite. No more than get it forwards means "to their 9 foot centre half."

We've seen long ball teams play it across their back line aimlessly. It looks no better then either! Still shit. (If that helps any)

[Worthy4England]

^^ So you're not advocating "Just hoof it!" Either? I'm wondering where the just hoof it contingent actually are, other than in people's heads....

I thought Rotherham played decent football when they went up (<50% possession), I also thought Ipswich did ~60% possession. I can forgive 15 crosses we miss by a whisker easier than 10 passes from Santos to Toal to Sheehan to Santos to Baxter to Santos to "big hopeful diagonal" that their defence have just waited patiently for.

Interestingly (or not) I had the symmetrical thought reading you and BWFC-I - who exactly are all these "keep possession for the sake of possession" people?

It'd be them folks ponderously knocking the thought around in their yed! Instead of getting it posted, with pace and intent!

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

^^ So you're not advocating "Just hoof it!" Either? I'm wondering where the just hoof it contingent actually are, other than in people's heads....

I thought Rotherham played decent football when they went up (<50% possession), I also thought Ipswich did ~60% possession. I can forgive 15 crosses we miss by a whisker easier than 10 passes from Santos to Toal to Sheehan to Santos to Baxter to Santos to "big hopeful diagonal" that their defence have just waited patiently for.

Interestingly (or not) I had the symmetrical thought reading you and BWFC-I - who exactly are all these "keep possession for the sake of possession" people?

It'd be them folks ponderously knocking the thought around in their yed! Instead of getting it posted, with pace and intent!

[BWFC_Insane]

Anyone answer the question - especially regular attendees, which player in this squad gets you off your seat? Who excites?

[Worthy4England]

Anyone answer the question - especially regular attendees, which player in this squad gets you off your seat? Who excites?

There's quite a few who get me off my seat, but I don't think that's answering the question you're asking!

I think about this one quite a lot, and TBF they're few and far between over 50 years! Quite early on Saturday, Matete went on a couple of delightful runs, maybe there's some hope there...Anyone scoring, is going to get me stood up for a moment...but exciting players. Few and far between.