Who's the Rioch to Evatt's Neal?

[BWFC_Insane]

Aye, I'm pretty similar. Schumacher [Ed: won't be calling him SS!] the clear front runner for me. Would only be looking at others if he was a no. Then Buckingham would be in there with the likes of Lowe as not my first choice but fine, a long way ahead of the Rooneys "oh god this will be a disaster".

Schumacher for me. Second is Wagner or Edwards I think now - I think O Neil is one I’m going off a bit.

Allardyce was pushing Rob Edwards and Wagner to me would potentially have a bit of Bruce Rioch about him. Might not work but might also fire the whole club and town up a bit. And he has worked with Markham before.

[KeyserSoze]

Ha, I did my first subbing test interviee last year for the first time in about a decade when I moved from in-house comms to (relatively) boiler room subbing.

I got the job, but still have nightmares about the atrocity of an article I faced for the second half of that test. I just stared at it for 15 minutes of the allotted 30 wondering what I could even salvage from the wreckage some editors are cruel.

Congrats -assuming it was a move you wanted to make. Subbing (which, to explain for those who don’t know and might wonder, is essentially checking other people’s writing for accuracy, grammar, fluency etc) is definitely something I’d test candidates for… and whether I was setting or sitting the test I’d make clear how much change was allowed/expected. Sorry to hear you got a word salad, but I imagine that’s to show you’re happy doing major surgery and not just spellchecking.

Anyway, about Stephan Shoemaker…

Thanks, and yeah the word salad was designed to test your 'fight or flight' response to an absolute crock of shit. Wasn't having the best of times back then, so getting through that and landing the job was a nice reminder that hey, you know what, I'm actually quite good at my job.

Was nice being in a team with several old-school subs who take no prisoners. Felt quite old school, even if I don't know exactly what that ever was. Back in London now, hopefully see you at an away day or two, mate.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Thanks, and yeah the word salad was designed to test your 'fight or flight' response to an absolute crock of shit. Wasn't having the best of times back then, so getting through that and landing the job was a nice reminder that hey, you know what, I'm actually quite good at my job.

Was nice being in a team with several old-school subs who take no prisoners. Felt quite old school, even if I don't know exactly what that ever was. Back in London now, hopefully see you at an away day or two, mate.

Always great to hear if someone's lucky enough to enjoy their work and see it as a vocation – far too many folk sadly aren't in that position.

Look forward to seeing you soon as part of [NAME TO BE DECIDED'S] Superwhite Army

[GhostoftheBok]

The fact is that most managerial appointments, even those made by competent people relying on good advice, fail.

You can make arguments for and against all these guys in the frame. None of them are obvious chancers and none of them have proven completely bulletproof. You could view Rob Edwards as a modern Owen Coyle, if you were feeling harsh.

The man is the unknown. We can all see results, tactics, etc...they'd all do fine as pundits or analysts. Whether they'll rally the troops when the tactics aren't working, or get players to give more than they think they have, is something none of us here can assess. Hopefully the interview process gives a decent insight for the selectors and they make the choice purely on the basis of who they think is most likely to improve the football department - rather than other considerations.

No small part of this will come down to luck. This football club is due some of that.

Any remotely sensible appointment has to be backed to the hilt by the fans and we'll see where we are come May.

[BWFC_Insane]

The fact is that most managerial appointments, even those made by competent people relying on good advice, fail.

You can make arguments for and against all these guys in the frame. None of them are obvious chancers and none of them have proven completely bulletproof. You could view Rob Edwards as a modern Owen Coyle, if you were feeling harsh.

The man is the unknown. We can all see results, tactics, etc...they'd all do fine as pundits or analysts. Whether they'll rally the troops when the tactics aren't working, or get players to give more than they think they have, is something none of us here can assess. Hopefully the interview process gives a decent insight for the selectors and they make the choice purely on the basis of who they think is most likely to improve the football department - rather than other considerations.

No small part of this will come down to luck. This football club is due some of that.

Any remotely sensible appointment has to be backed to the hilt by the fans and we'll see where we are come May.

Agree with this mostly. Those meeting people and having conversations should hopefully be better informed. And you are correct there is something more than a record. Someone’s ability to lead the club comes down to a set of intangibles that are hard to determine let alone measure.

No manager should be judged in May. If they achieve something by then that’s great. But the key is being automatic promotion candidates next season imho.

[GhostoftheBok]

No manager should be judged in May. If they achieve something by then that’s great. But the key is being automatic promotion candidates next season imho.

I tend to agree. However, I meant it may be clear if they're a total car crash at that stage - rather than whether they get us up or not.

[BWFC_Insane]

No manager should be judged in May. If they achieve something by then that’s great. But the key is being automatic promotion candidates next season imho.

I tend to agree. However, I meant it may be clear if they're a total car crash at that stage - rather than whether they get us up or not.

Maybe but car crash’s show things need changing. And they haven’t assembled the squad. So I think they’d get longer than that for me. If someone comes in and it’s a car crash then either Sharon is a disaster at picking managers or we need a lot of players moving on.

I’d like to think that it’s not a car crash. Right now I suspect most of the names on the list we are looking at 10th place or so finish and some changes in the summer. And those changes need to put us right in contention.

They are working with someone else’s squad and we know the squad is quite flawed. That will take time and more than a week of a window to sort.

[GhostoftheBok]

We'll see what goes on. My usual rule with managers is that they get 2 years (4 windows) from me, unless there's something very, very wrong. Every promotion extends that by a year.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Bookies had Buckingham odds-on overnight but he's now drifted back outside Schumacher, which shows how the odds are always hugely open to interpretation (and subject to fluctuation when more hopeful punters are parted with their cash).

Buckingham did a decent job and shows that you don't need a long CV to win promotion. Essentially, his tweak from a failing 4-2-3-1 to 4-3-3 - just inverting from a "10 in front of two" to a "6 behind two 8s" - was enough to arrest the slide they were on and win them promotion, helped by his Wembley opponent's tactical paralysis.

I suspect some fans may be underwhelmed if Des were appointed. There may be a strong reason not to pick Schumacher but it would have to be explained - which would be hard for Sharon to do but could be leaked out.

[BWFC_Insane]

We'll see what goes on. My usual rule with managers is that they get 2 years (4 windows) from me, unless there's something very, very wrong. Every promotion extends that by a year.

Yeah Sammy Lee - a lovely lovely man but it was very clearly a mess from the off. But mostly people need some time.

[Mar]

I suspect some fans may be underwhelmed if Des were appointed. There may be a strong reason not to pick Schumacher but it would have to be explained - which would be hard for Sharon to do but could be leaked out.

Schumacher's clearly got the better record and a questionable sacking by Stoke doesn't exactly taint his record.

What I like is that Schumacher's got a managerial record that spans over a few seasons with one club, which shows he can build a team going forward.

I do wonder whether some of these potential appointees have a history of moulding players into a team image rather than just rallying the troops and getting the best of them. It's the difference between Coyle and Allardyce for me. I'd much rather we get the right guy in that can build a team for the future rather than just getting an immediate lift. Heck Stoke haven't managed to better his 2 wins in 5 games (in the league) for the rest of their campaign.

If you take into account the cups, he was sacked with 4 wins in 7. Seems like Walters had a bee in his bonnet over losing to Oxford United and gave him the boot. Results like that happen, but I would imagine after being under not-so-supportive ownership that Schumacher may just fancy some Sharon-esque style support.

[Worthy4England]

We'll see what goes on. My usual rule with managers is that they get 2 years (4 windows) from me, unless there's something very, very wrong. Every promotion extends that by a year.

Yeah Sammy Lee - a lovely lovely man but it was very clearly a mess from the off. But mostly people need some time.

A mess? I believe Garty's words were succession plan!

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Right now I suspect most of the names on the list we are looking at 10th place or so finish and some changes in the summer. And those changes need to put us right in contention.

They are working with someone else’s squad and we know the squad is quite flawed. That will take time and more than a week of a window to sort.

Interestingly low bar.

Personally I'm hoping we'll push for the playoffs; I wouldn't want him sacked if we finish 7th but we're not miles behind and we should improve. We have good players and hopefully soon a good coach who can use them well. Yes, he might want/need one or two but we shouldn't be looking at a Year Zero ground-up rebuild.

Seems like Walters had a bee in his bonnet over losing to Oxford United and gave him the boot. Results like that happen, but I would imagine after being under not-so-supportive ownership that Schumacher may just fancy some Sharon-esque style support.

Yeah.
• If we believe the oatcake-botherer that our poster Frank Drebin was talking to at the airport, it sounds like Walters clashed with Schuey quite unprofessionally.
• Even if we don't believe that bit, given how quickly Pelach was appointed thereafter it feels like Walters - who had been appointed as technical director after Schumacher was made manager - was ready to pull the trigger.
• And it's also possible Walters had been persuading the Bet365-owning chairman to roll the dice again, given the wording of the sacking announcement ("After ongoing discussions with John Coates, we feel the time is right for a change in direction to bring success to the club.")

As you say, working with Markham and Sharon looks lovely compared to that.

[BWFC_Insane]

Right now I suspect most of the names on the list we are looking at 10th place or so finish and some changes in the summer. And those changes need to put us right in contention.

They are working with someone else’s squad and we know the squad is quite flawed. That will take time and more than a week of a window to sort.

Interestingly low bar.

Personally I'm hoping we'll push for the playoffs; I wouldn't want him sacked if we finish 7th but we're not miles behind and we should improve. We have good players and hopefully soon a good coach who can use them well. Yes, he might want/need one or two but we shouldn't be looking at a Year Zero ground-up rebuild.

Seems like Walters had a bee in his bonnet over losing to Oxford United and gave him the boot. Results like that happen, but I would imagine after being under not-so-supportive ownership that Schumacher may just fancy some Sharon-esque style support.

Yeah.
• If we believe the oatcake-botherer that our poster Frank Drebin was talking to at the airport, it sounds like Walters clashed with Schuey quite unprofessionally.
• Even if we don't believe that bit, given how quickly Pelach was appointed thereafter it feels like Walters - who had been appointed as technical director after Schumacher was made manager - was ready to pull the trigger.
• And it's also possible Walters had been persuading the Bet365-owning chairman to roll the dice again, given the wording of the sacking announcement ("After ongoing discussions with John Coates, we feel the time is right for a change in direction to bring success to the club.")

As you say, working with Markham and Sharon looks lovely compared to that.

I agree I just don’t think a new manager coming in end of January should be judged on what happens up to May too much. If we aren’t right up there the season after then I will be having an issue.


And that’s not to say I don’t think it possible someone comes in and lifts us and gets us competing for the top 6. It’s possible. I just wouldn’t hold it against them if they didn’t. If we really struggled I might become a bit worried.

[Bijou Bob]

Sharon's treatment of Evatt would seem to indicate that the board will take their time, pick the right candidate and give them time to build some momentum. No one would want us to become another Stoke, Watford or Wolves.

I'm happy to accept that promotion via the play offs might be a step too far. Show me progress, a change in style and give me victories against clubs above us and I'd accept 7/8th place and hope we can build for next season. I certainly wouldn't be calling for anyone's head this season, even if we finished midway or slightly under. The new guy deserves a summer window, a squad refresh and some time to impose their regime, their style and their rules.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Steve Evans here, not doing a great job of endearing himself to a presumably already sub-whelmed Rotherham public.

“I've not had any contact from Bolton I got a call from the people who look after me on the business side just to see if there would be any interest on my behalf.
“I love that club. I started there as an apprentice looking after the Sam Allardyces, Frank Worthingtons and Peter Reids. I've got a lot of affinity with the club. Every time I go there I see people who I remember and who remember me. It's a brilliant club. I know one of two of the senior people there as well.
"But my only task is making Rotherham United better. I was very fortunate that my chairman and vice-chairman stood shoulder to shoulder with me in a little spell that was difficult for everyone. They showed me tremendous loyalty and the least I can do is return that loyalty.”

[BWFC_Insane]

Steve Evans here, not doing a great job of endearing himself to a presumably already sub-whelmed Rotherham public.

“I've not had any contact from Bolton I got a call from the people who look after me on the business side just to see if there would be any interest on my behalf.
“I love that club. I started there as an apprentice looking after the Sam Allardyces, Frank Worthingtons and Peter Reids. I've got a lot of affinity with the club. Every time I go there I see people who I remember and who remember me. It's a brilliant club. I know one of two of the senior people there as well.
"But my only task is making Rotherham United better. I was very fortunate that my chairman and vice-chairman stood shoulder to shoulder with me in a little spell that was difficult for everyone. They showed me tremendous loyalty and the least I can do is return that loyalty.”

Talk was that some on the board were pushing for Evans. These comments somewhat perhaps suggest that might be the case. I wonder who knows him?

[GhostoftheBok]

Steve Evans here, not doing a great job of endearing himself to a presumably already sub-whelmed Rotherham public.

A safe assumption. I walked away from their ground chatting to a local who said he'd happily trade managers..."And not just with you, with fecking anyone."

[BWFC_Insane]

Slightly concerning that Markham and the Liverpool data mob are leading the process. I’m not convinced data sheets tell us who is a good leader and man manager. The qualities that made Big Sam so good. We can sort technical coaching but it’s about an ability to motivate players and build a culture for me.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Talk was that some on the board were pushing for Evans. These comments somewhat perhaps suggest that might be the case. I wonder who knows him?

I didn’t read it that way. I read it as the Steve Evans PLC sales department asking the CEO if they wanted to explore a market.