Who's the Rioch to Evatt's Neal?

[Mar]

Etete in on loan.

We started off the season clearly missing a big unit up top. Etete being 6ft 6 should certainly help give us options. Not sure we've improved in goalscoring output given he's got 3 goals in both the previous two league seasons and none this season (hamstring injury). Still, i'd imagine his job isn't scoring goals it'll be bringing others into play and keeping the ball up top.

Under pressure, no problem, lets get it to Etete and play from there.

[GhostoftheBok]

Santos is a very good player. We have a lot of very good players. Schumacher has praised them in the past and knows what he is getting.

The question is whether he can turn this group into dominant team, or if it stays a collection of talented lads until summer.

[BWFC_Insane]

I agree broadly with what Iles has said that Santos was very tied up with Evatt and the way Evatt wanted to play but a more basic approach we’ve seen under Jules suits Forrester, Johnston and Toal arguably more. Santos could absolutely fit in but it’s about cost. Evatt needed his recovery for a high line and couldn’t find anyone else. As Iles says we’ve already got options who can do it if we aren’t so high up the pitch. Depends I think on whether the cost is worth it for Schumacher.

[boltonboris]

If we just wanted Rico to defend without all the patterns and delays, he’d be right up there as one of, if not THE best defender in the division.

His main limitations stem from confidence after he’s turned the ball over

[Prufrock]

Rico depends I guess on any interest, both signing a new deal Vs money in. But if he stays I'd expect both him and Toal to play a big part. Any manager has to back themselves to get the most out of a 6'5" monster who is also quick and comfortable on the ball. Back themself to get a similar jump to what we've seen from the others. And Toal will be fundamental I'd think. He'd have been made for the last two games, and hopefully Schumacher isn't going to ask any of them to do things they can't.

Here's the thing. If all Santos could do was put his foot on the ball annd pass it sideways, he'd be a very limited player. But he's also (at his best) very fast, good at heading clear (as long as he's not man-marking) and strong enough to hold off most strikers.

I think Rico has suffered from being Evatt's Play Out From the Back Poster-boy, perhaps the key memory being Wembley; but it's not his fault Oxford had closed off his lanes, nor is it his fault that Evatt didn't have another idea. Hopefully those days have gone, and if we shear off that layer of tactical expectatipn, there's still a worrthwhile player there - maybe one who can play even better without those worries.

Toal's similar, but less so. He's built for the battle, he's tall, not terrible on the ball – not good enough for Evattball's underlapping outside centre-backs, but again that's likely gone.

I'm not sure there's many games (in this division) where we would thrive creatively by having three KickItHeadItClearIt centre-backs. But it's good to have the options.

Agree with all that. There's a long way between kickitheaditclearit and where we were. Any manager would back themselves to make Rico the best defender in the league.

But equally I think partly *because* he became the poster boy and he might want out and so we might want to cash in. I'd be saying to him I want you to stay but you need to be all in and sign a new contract. Otherwise we need the cash.

[Worthy4England]

As we keep saying. It's only in part about the jigsaw pieces. They're only a means to complete (or otherwise) the puzzle. For every "look at the conveyor belt they're producing" conversation, there's plenty more that aren't and that's where the win is. RedShite have had some talented players, it can't be all down to just the manager that they haven't for a while fitted together well. There's plenty of others, I mean look at the remarkable trophy cabinet at Spurs. The model is overly complex and it's why I prefer more conventional managers, regardless of fads.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

There's a long way between kickitheaditclearit and where we were. Any manager would back themselves to make Rico the best defender in the league.

But equally I think partly *because* he became the poster boy and he might want out and so we might want to cash in. I'd be saying to him I want you to stay but you need to be all in and sign a new contract. Otherwise we need the cash.

Yeah. It's sort of "Hurry up and wait" - either he goes this weekend or we have three months to see if Schuey rates him. With six months on his contract he wouldn't raise much money if we sold him.

One potential problem is that he can't man-mark. Evatt successfully adapted to include this, giving him the free role to attack crosses, but it depends whether any other manager is happy to let one of his centre-backs avoid marking duty. (No idea where Schuey is on zonal vs man-marking.)

[Worthy4England]

One potential problem is that he can't man-mark. Evatt successfully adapted to include this, giving him the free role to attack crosses, but it depends whether any other manager is happy to let one of his centre-backs avoid marking duty. (No idea where Schuey is on zonal vs man-marking.)

Not quite sure where I'd begin to deal with this assessment of how we defend!

[BWFC_Insane]

There's a long way between kickitheaditclearit and where we were. Any manager would back themselves to make Rico the best defender in the league.

But equally I think partly *because* he became the poster boy and he might want out and so we might want to cash in. I'd be saying to him I want you to stay but you need to be all in and sign a new contract. Otherwise we need the cash.

Yeah. It's sort of "Hurry up and wait" - either he goes this weekend or we have three months to see if Schuey rates him. With six months on his contract he wouldn't raise much money if we sold him.

One potential problem is that he can't man-mark. Evatt successfully adapted to include this, giving him the free role to attack crosses, but it depends whether any other manager is happy to let one of his centre-backs avoid marking duty. (No idea where Schuey is on zonal vs man-marking.)

Is it possible that Schuey and his, on paper at least, superior coaching staff might be able to fix this somewhat?

[Bijou Bob]

If as Shuey suggested, conversations have been ongoing with Markham for days now, I would have thought that Santos' situation would have been near to the top of the list. One way or another, I'm sure conversations will be ongoing right now with his agent, either to sort a new deal or to find him a move in the next 72 hours.

[GhostoftheBok]

The club froze talks with players a bit ago. There was a blanket "Nobody is getting a new deal" around December.

Suggestion has been that Rico and others were willing to sit down, but the club said no until they had an idea of what was going on past this season.

I suppose it's possible that Schumacher coming in has forced the club to hammer down on plans for the next 18 months. That might mean Schumacher is able to hand out some deals and cement commitment from players who were lagging a bit.

It's a totally new day, so it's not even educated guesswork now - just guesswork.

[BWFC_Insane]

If as Shuey suggested, conversations have been ongoing with Markham for days now, I would have thought that Santos' situation would have been near to the top of the list. One way or another, I'm sure conversations will be ongoing right now with his agent, either to sort a new deal or to find him a move in the next 72 hours.

I doubt they will sell santos now for a few reasons.

First being value is low. Nobody will pay that much for him - he’s carrying a niggly injury and is out of contract in 6 months. Nearly 30. Clubs will wait.

Second being his best chance of a bumper deal is to stay and run his deal down. If we want to keep him we compete against the market and the market drives his next contract up wherever it may be.

Third - it would be a big call to actively sell santos days after Schumacher arrives and before he’s had a chance to properly assess the squad or work with Santos.

This assumes there isn’t a decent offer from somewhere already in for him but one assumes we’d have heard by now.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

One potential problem is that he can't man-mark.

Is it possible that Schuey and his, on paper at least, superior coaching staff might be able to fix this somewhat?

Most things are possible. It's worth noting that that switch, freeing up Rico, now dates back more than four years - to a time when we were generally very poor all over the place. But I still recall Pru's deathless description of Rico at Colchester turning in the worst performance he'd seen at any level good enough to have a referee. Since then he's just been told to ignore the oppo and get to the ball first. It's worked more often than not.

It's possible that a new coaching staff will have different plans, and indeed different abilities they can bring out of players. We sure hope so. As you say, one of those might include making Rico a more rounded centre-back - and as Boris says, if he can be spared the psychic yoke of being expected to be the Barnet Beckenbauer then maybe he can grow still further. There's a reason he was beloved by many for a long time.

[Worthy4England]

I'm not in the Rico's the reason squad. When he's fannying that's sorta the gameplan, when he's wondering what to do because they had the temerity to put bodies between him and Sheehan, that was the plan too, with the 8's parked somewhere near Watford. He's not decided to mark random space under his own steam, etc.

On that basis, I would be fine with Schumaker seeing what happens with some tweaks. There was that game against Colchester, then he went through a bit of a Damascus moment, became better as did our defending, then it got overengineered.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Kyle has an interesting back story, as detailed in the below Athletic article, and seems like he might be a very good addition.

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/539329 ... er-league/

He’s another boyhood Everton fan who’s the same age as Schuey, so I wonder whether maybe they know each other from school days?

Thanks for that - it's a fascinating story. In summary, for those who don't have either an Athletic subscription or the time to read it:
• 2021-2024 Rob Edwards's assistant at Forest Green, Watford and Luton (two promotions)
• 2020-2021 assistant to Bev Priestman, Canada Women (they won Olympic Gold shortly after he left for FGR)
• 2017-2020 at St George's Park as "out of possession" (ie defending) coach and assistant for England U16 & U20 (Bellingham, Cole Palmner, etc)
• 2013-2017 at Blackpool, first as academy manager then as Gary Bowyer's assistant manager during 2017 tier-four promotion via play-offs
• was also a PE teacher while working part-time at Blackpool

[brommers95]

Over the moon with this. It was an absolute no-brainer and has been for about three months. I was getting slightly nervous with it ‘dragging on’ that we were going to do something stupid and appoint someone not named Steven Schumacher.

Anyway happy days. Going to be a frantic few days in the transfer market and then we crack on and get promoted.

Steven Schumacher’s Super White Army

Nice to see you back on here, Brommers.

I’m always lurking lad, just more of a reader than a writer

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Schuey discussing Matete re Crawley game but broad enough quotes to be included in this thread...

https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/sport/2 ... ay-matete/

Jay won’t have enjoyed missing the last three games. The odd incident was what it was – but he has definitely paid the price for it. He will have a point to prove now. He knows what I expect from him and everyone else in the team, so it might even give him a little head start on some of the non-negotiables that I expect and how I like to work. I’m very hopeful that we will now see the best of him in the run-in.

I've used him in different roles. So when we took Jay – and he made his debut here against Bolton – we used him as a 10 and he got around the single pivot, which was Aaron Morley, and stopped him getting on the ball. Jay's best strength is he regains the ball for you high up the pitch, and when he receives the ball closer to the opposition goal, he's got some quality. He chipped in with a couple of really important goals for us at Plymouth in that run-in when we won the league, so he's a good player.

I also played him as a double pivot in certain games when we felt we were going to be in control of the ball, which he's capable of doing. He's an all-round midfield player, I would say, that can do a little bit of everything, which is good, and he's a player in the squad that I know and I can trust, and I think he'll do a great job for us.

Sounds to me like he'd trust him in the middle of the 3-4-2-1. But it's not just about formations, is it? Talk to me, Steve:

Some of the early messages we gave the players were to try and be positive, always try and threaten the back line where we can. Now, I obviously want the team to have a possession-based style, that's what this team and this squad have been used to, and we've got some really good players that can control possession, but we just explained that it doesn't always have to be in 15-20 pass sequences. If we can regain the ball and get at the opposition straight away, then let's do that.

[Worthy4England]

I don't think anyone's much against us having the ball. But that last bit is pretty important. 15-20 passes to oppo third only to then stand there wondering what the fcuk to do with it, because they had a week to assemble their low block, isn't it. That's just boredom central.

[BWFC_Insane]

Schuey discussing Matete re Crawley game but broad enough quotes to be included in this thread...

https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/sport/2 ... ay-matete/

Jay won’t have enjoyed missing the last three games. The odd incident was what it was – but he has definitely paid the price for it. He will have a point to prove now. He knows what I expect from him and everyone else in the team, so it might even give him a little head start on some of the non-negotiables that I expect and how I like to work. I’m very hopeful that we will now see the best of him in the run-in.

I've used him in different roles. So when we took Jay – and he made his debut here against Bolton – we used him as a 10 and he got around the single pivot, which was Aaron Morley, and stopped him getting on the ball. Jay's best strength is he regains the ball for you high up the pitch, and when he receives the ball closer to the opposition goal, he's got some quality. He chipped in with a couple of really important goals for us at Plymouth in that run-in when we won the league, so he's a good player.

I also played him as a double pivot in certain games when we felt we were going to be in control of the ball, which he's capable of doing. He's an all-round midfield player, I would say, that can do a little bit of everything, which is good, and he's a player in the squad that I know and I can trust, and I think he'll do a great job for us.

Sounds to me like he'd trust him in the middle of the 3-4-2-1. But it's not just about formations, is it? Talk to me, Steve:

Some of the early messages we gave the players were to try and be positive, always try and threaten the back line where we can. Now, I obviously want the team to have a possession-based style, that's what this team and this squad have been used to, and we've got some really good players that can control possession, but we just explained that it doesn't always have to be in 15-20 pass sequences. If we can regain the ball and get at the opposition straight away, then let's do that.

The last bit is exactly what I’ve been thinking for a long time. We did that with Kieran Lee in the team but since then Evatt hasn’t seemingly bothered. We absolutely need to regain possession more and be that bit more direct when we do at times. If Matete can be used to win it back higher up the pitch that would be great.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

I haven't voted yet but I think Schuey is the obvious candidate, assuming the interview goes well. (...) The problem might be if he wants a Champo job but you imagine we'd also tick a lot of boxes for him, too.

I think it might be in our favour that there are unlikely to be any Championship jobs available in the next few months. Maybe Cardiff and maaaybe Derby, but that looks about it.

Yep. Reading the bottom half from the bottom up, Plymouth, Luton, Hull, Cardiff, Stoke, Preston, Millwall, Oxford and Coventry have all mae a managerial change this season; the only exceptions are Pompey (22nd), Derby (20th) and Swansea (15th), of whom only Derby might seriously consider a change.

Returning to this in a grave-quiet week because the Swansea comment didn't age well... they've sacked Luke WIlliams, having already lost their DoF and captain. They're in such a mess there's even talk of temporarily abandoning their preference for passing football...
https://www.theguardian.com/football/20 ... e-of-exits
Derby also bounced Warne, the kind of nonsense-allergic manager to whom clubs are drawn when high-falutin projects fail, which means that of the current bottom 11 clubs only Pompey haven't had a managerial change this season. Some division, that.