Schu me the way to Amarillo - Summer 2025 Transfer Thread

[Worthy4England]

Gotta say, I'm a bit bemused at how many defenders we seem to want to keep.

It's strange in a way, on one hand I look at them individually and they don't seem that bad but then every one of them has a flaw that I don't think you can make up for. Forino works hard he's an okay defender but he's got too many mistakes in him even at this level. Johnston is a good tackler but he's very poor in the air, too poor for league 1 football frankly. Forester just doesn't strike me as that good, tbh, it's hard to put my finger on but he's not aggressive enough, seems too soft for a CB. Toal is probably the best IMO but so injury prone.

Sometimes if a player has a bad attribute you can make it work but I don't think there's anything you can do with CBs who make mistakes or are crap in the air they're just fatal flaws that no amount of quality or compensating will ever make up for.

I dunno it's late and I can't sleep so typed this crap out frankly I wouldn't bat an eyelid at any or all of them leaving.

Sorta my point even half asleep mate. We've let 68 goals in with 2 to play. The last time we got relegated from L1 we let in 66. Sure it was only 34 games coz of rona at 1.94 gapg, but we rolled out the u18's the start of that season. This year we're at 1.54, think DSB posted we were now at higher than that under Schuey and people want to keep the majority of the defenders as we've got progressively worse. I know all "defending" isn't just those three in the middle, but given our GA column, there's rather more than circumstantial evidence that they're fcuking clueless.

[TANGODANCER]

Gotta say, I'm a bit bemused at how many defenders we seem to want to keep.

Aye, particularly since they have "collectively" managed to lose us so many games. Soft goals, weak physical inability against bullying, bad marking, too chancy reliant on offside against speedy wingers and persistent refusal to change something obviously not working. Strange also that so many fans seem aware of our faults rather more than the manager.

That'll do for now since it's obviously locking the stable door with the horse gone with the wind.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

The other thing is that we're presuming Santos and Jones are leaving, so that frees up slots for a newcomer or two.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Oof - some damning numbers from Ilesy, at both ends:

"Of the 33 goalkeepers in League One to have made 15 starts this season, Baxter ranks 26th and Southwood 30th for save percentage."

"Wanderers have conceded 68 goals – the most since being relegated out of the Championship in 2018 – and have conceded 19 from set pieces, the fourth highest total in the division."

"61 ‘big chances’ missed ranking them the joint-sixth most wasteful attack, according to Opta."

[Worthy4England]

Gotta say, I'm a bit bemused at how many defenders we seem to want to keep.

Aye, particularly since they have "collectively" managed to lose us so many games. Soft goals, weak physical inability against bullying, bad marking, too chancy reliant on offside against speedy wingers and persistent refusal to change something obviously not working. Strange also that so many fans seem aware of our faults rather more than the manager.

That'll do for now since it's obviously locking the stable door with the horse gone with the wind.

All of those things TD. They've been collectively awful.

[Worthy4England]

Oof - some damning numbers from Ilesy, at both ends:

"Of the 33 goalkeepers in League One to have made 15 starts this season, Baxter ranks 26th and Southwood 30th for save percentage."

"Wanderers have conceded 68 goals – the most since being relegated out of the Championship in 2018 – and have conceded 19 from set pieces, the fourth highest total in the division."

"61 ‘big chances’ missed ranking them the joint-sixth most wasteful attack, according to Opta."

19 from set pieces. That's the defence we're making the case for keeping. If you make one mistake every four/five games as a defender, be it poor marking, weak challenge, not being wise enough to get away from some holding, shirt tugging and chucking your arms up hoping the ref spots it, that's in the realms of not good enough.

There is so much poor, we accept from this lot. Whilst I'm on a roll, passing. We've signed lots of the "technically gifted" how many times do we see them under zero pressure hit a ball a farmers field away from where it should be? They're getting paid 2-4 grand a week I suspect as a min-range punt.

We need some minimum standards below which "nowhere near good enough," applies rather tgan constant benefit of the doubt. If they'd rather a comforting arm around them, they can go spend their redundancy with Mummy.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Who would you keep, Worthy?

[Worthy4England]

Who would you keep, Worthy?

They can all go for me. But we know that isn't going to happen. We need 1 preferably 2 CD's coming in, who understand "defending" and for me act as "leader of the defence," because we lack on field organisation. But we might be able to get away with playing one of the two new recruits, in any given formation which would leave 1 CD in a 4 or 2 in a three, that could be from our existing stock - they would by necessity come from Forino, Toal and GJ...as that's pretty much what we have if we assume Geth and Santos BWexit.

I think we need to look at their defensive stats as the starting point, but not just the ones that get you green on "whoscored" - the ones that tell you, you didn't pick your man up, or that you did, but they bullied you off it, or that you were way out of position or that 3 of you were marking space, or one of you let the ball bounce in the 6 yard box...

I'm probably nearer Pru's "probably Toal" than "let's keep the lot"

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Who would you keep, Worthy?

They can all go for me. But we know that isn't going to happen. We need 1 preferably 2 CD's coming in, who understand "defending" and for me act as "leader of the defence," because we lack on field organisation. But we might be able to get away with playing one of the two new recruits, in any given formation which would leave 1 CD in a 4 or 2 in a three, that could be from our existing stock - they would by necessity come from Forino, Toal and GJ...as that's pretty much what we have if we assume Geth and Santos BWexit.

I think we need to look at their defensive stats as the starting point, but not just the ones that get you green on "whoscored" - the ones that tell you, you didn't pick your man up, or that you did, but they bullied you off it, or that you were way out of position or that 3 of you were marking space, or one of you let the ball bounce in the 6 yard box...

I'm probably nearer Pru's "probably Toal" than "let's keep the lot"

All reasonable. Fairly sure the Evattian idea of Total Football - prioritising how good a goalkeeper is with his feet, how many passes a centre-back can make - is over, and while it's still useful to have a centre-back who can pass and a keeper who doesn't panic it into touch every time, it's more important the goalie can save and the defender can tackle. The cart came before the horse...

I still find it interesting that at the end of last summer's window Evatt targeted Liam Cooper - an ex-Chesterfield mate, yes, but presumably precisely the kind of gnarly warrior we now want. As it transpired, Cooper went to CSKA Sofia on a three-year contract at the age of 33 after diminishing numbers of league appearances, so I'm not sure the maths and money would have added up for us anyway, but hey-ho. Let's see who's around now.

I do think hiring a modern-day Wheater and MJ (not precisely those, but you know what I mean) would drag a few of those defenders up to being perfectly serviceable in this division. It's also possible that once we get a decent No.9 (or two) then the front-end bag of bits will fall into place a lot more - not everyone at once, but that's OK, they either knuckle down and take their chances.... or they go somewhere else.

'Cos while I'm not quite with you on "They can all go", there aren't many players I'd be sad to see go, both emotionally and tactically. Maybe just Morley. I think we'd struggle to get another JDC. I'd be sad to see Toal go without having grown into the player I hoped. Tomo would be sadder 'personally' than 'professionally', Collins the opposite – I'd worry in terms of replacing his goals/assists rather than weeping for a loved one.

[TANGODANCER]

Based purely on results, Mr Schumacher would be packing his bag. Amidst howls of disapproval, facts are facts, as we are so often told, and "what can't speak can't lie". I'd love to be wrong.

[The_Gun]

Who would you keep, Worthy?

They can all go for me. But we know that isn't going to happen. We need 1 preferably 2 CD's coming in, who understand "defending" and for me act as "leader of the defence," because we lack on field organisation. But we might be able to get away with playing one of the two new recruits, in any given formation which would leave 1 CD in a 4 or 2 in a three, that could be from our existing stock - they would by necessity come from Forino, Toal and GJ...as that's pretty much what we have if we assume Geth and Santos BWexit.

I think we need to look at their defensive stats as the starting point, but not just the ones that get you green on "whoscored" - the ones that tell you, you didn't pick your man up, or that you did, but they bullied you off it, or that you were way out of position or that 3 of you were marking space, or one of you let the ball bounce in the 6 yard box...

I'm probably nearer Pru's "probably Toal" than "let's keep the lot"

All reasonable. Fairly sure the Evattian idea of Total Football - prioritising how good a goalkeeper is with his feet, how many passes a centre-back can make - is over, and while it's still useful to have a centre-back who can pass and a keeper who doesn't panic it into touch every time, it's more important the goalie can save and the defender can tackle. The cart came before the horse...

I still find it interesting that at the end of last summer's window Evatt targeted Liam Cooper - an ex-Chesterfield mate, yes, but presumably precisely the kind of gnarly warrior we now want. As it transpired, Cooper went to CSKA Sofia on a three-year contract at the age of 33 after diminishing numbers of league appearances, so I'm not sure the maths and money would have added up for us anyway, but hey-ho. Let's see who's around now.

I do think hiring a modern-day Wheater and MJ (not precisely those, but you know what I mean) would drag a few of those defenders up to being perfectly serviceable in this division. It's also possible that once we get a decent No.9 (or two) then the front-end bag of bits will fall into place a lot more - not everyone at once, but that's OK, they either knuckle down and take their chances.... or they go somewhere else.

'Cos while I'm not quite with you on "They can all go", there aren't many players I'd be sad to see go, both emotionally and tactically. Maybe just Morley. I think we'd struggle to get another JDC. I'd be sad to see Toal go without having grown into the player I hoped. Tomo would be sadder 'personally' than 'professionally', Collins the opposite – I'd worry in terms of replacing his goals/assists rather than weeping for a loved one.

Looking at experienced (but not too experienced) CBs with expiring contracts, currently playing in the Championship throws up:

Matt Clarke (Derby)
Semi Ajayi (West Brom)
Jack Robinson (Sheff U)
Steve Cook (QPR)
Michael Rose (Stoke)
Shaun Hutchinson (Millwall)
Patrick Bauer (Preston)
Danny Batth (Blackburn)

Some of those may be attainable, some probably not. Certainly a few players there who would add leadership at the back.

[Worthy4England]

Who would you keep, Worthy?

They can all go for me. But we know that isn't going to happen. We need 1 preferably 2 CD's coming in, who understand "defending" and for me act as "leader of the defence," because we lack on field organisation. But we might be able to get away with playing one of the two new recruits, in any given formation which would leave 1 CD in a 4 or 2 in a three, that could be from our existing stock - they would by necessity come from Forino, Toal and GJ...as that's pretty much what we have if we assume Geth and Santos BWexit.

I think we need to look at their defensive stats as the starting point, but not just the ones that get you green on "whoscored" - the ones that tell you, you didn't pick your man up, or that you did, but they bullied you off it, or that you were way out of position or that 3 of you were marking space, or one of you let the ball bounce in the 6 yard box...

I'm probably nearer Pru's "probably Toal" than "let's keep the lot"

All reasonable. Fairly sure the Evattian idea of Total Football - prioritising how good a goalkeeper is with his feet, how many passes a centre-back can make - is over, and while it's still useful to have a centre-back who can pass and a keeper who doesn't panic it into touch every time, it's more important the goalie can save and the defender can tackle. The cart came before the horse...

I still find it interesting that at the end of last summer's window Evatt targeted Liam Cooper - an ex-Chesterfield mate, yes, but presumably precisely the kind of gnarly warrior we now want. As it transpired, Cooper went to CSKA Sofia on a three-year contract at the age of 33 after diminishing numbers of league appearances, so I'm not sure the maths and money would have added up for us anyway, but hey-ho. Let's see who's around now.

I do think hiring a modern-day Wheater and MJ (not precisely those, but you know what I mean) would drag a few of those defenders up to being perfectly serviceable in this division. It's also possible that once we get a decent No.9 (or two) then the front-end bag of bits will fall into place a lot more - not everyone at once, but that's OK, they either knuckle down and take their chances.... or they go somewhere else.

'Cos while I'm not quite with you on "They can all go", there aren't many players I'd be sad to see go, both emotionally and tactically. Maybe just Morley. I think we'd struggle to get another JDC. I'd be sad to see Toal go without having grown into the player I hoped. Tomo would be sadder 'personally' than 'professionally', Collins the opposite – I'd worry in terms of replacing his goals/assists rather than weeping for a loved one.

What I mean by "they can all go," isn't "they should all go." We know we're going to need to keep some and some we might not be able to move even is we wanted to.

What I'm saying is if we had to keep 2 CD's from our current 4 of Toal, Forrester, Forino, GJ assuming Geth and Ric are off, I'm not sure I'd have a major preference for which 2 it was. But I'd want a defensive rock in there and it'd be which two could work with them as part of a team, rather than a collection of random stats...We might not know that until we sign them...

[Frank Drebin]

Oof - some damning numbers from Ilesy, at both ends:

"Of the 33 goalkeepers in League One to have made 15 starts this season, Baxter ranks 26th and Southwood 30th for save percentage."

"Wanderers have conceded 68 goals – the most since being relegated out of the Championship in 2018 – and have conceded 19 from set pieces, the fourth highest total in the division."

"61 ‘big chances’ missed ranking them the joint-sixth most wasteful attack, according to Opta."

I’m in the minority, I reckon, but if Baxter left, I wouldn’t bat an eyelid. The old adage a good big ‘un is better than a good little ‘un, rings true in this division. I’ve cast an envious eye at the Wrexham keeper and to the Stockport keeper this season. Imposing figures with a bigger reach, like we had with James Trafford.
You don’t see Baxter coming for crosses and taking no prisoners and we never will.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Looking at experienced (but not too experienced) CBs with expiring contracts, currently playing in the Championship throws up:

Matt Clarke (Derby)
Semi Ajayi (West Brom)
Jack Robinson (Sheff U)
Steve Cook (QPR)
Michael Rose (Stoke)
Shaun Hutchinson (Millwall)
Patrick Bauer (Preston)
Danny Batth (Blackburn)

Some of those may be attainable, some probably not. Certainly a few players there who would add leadership at the back.

Cheers. And four (so far) in this division:
PAUDIE O'CONNOR (28 in July) 6ft 3in centre-back. Brought from Ireland by Leeds, he's earned a lower-league reputation at Bradford and Lincoln, whose DoF admitted this spring they'd be lucky to keep their skipper – an "unbelievable leader" who's "fearless" and a "warrior". Plymouth bid £250,000 in January, and he will have options.

CAMERON HUMPHREYS (26) Not the Ipswich midfielder loaned to Wycombe, but a 6ft 2in Manc centre-back who came through City's system then went to Belgium for three years. In summer 2022 he joined second-tier Rotherham; this spring he's added a string to his bow with rave reviews as defensive midfielder, too. Rotherham want to keep him but he may be ready to leave. As might...

HAKEEM ODOFFIN (27) 6ft 3in Londoner who was with Spurs as a kid, later Wolves and Northampton, before moving to Scotland with Livingston and Hamilton for 18 months. In summer 2021 he joined third-tier Rotherham and helped them get up, and stay up. Odoffin has also played in defensive midfield. Both he and Humphreys looked likely to leave but may be more tempted to stay under new man Matt Hamshaw.

MATTY PEARSON (32 in August) Out of contract at Huddersfield, the 6ft 3in centre-back is well-liked among fans. On Blackburn's books as a kid, drifted via Rochdale into non-league but bounced back via Halifax and Accy to second-tier Barnsley, then helped Luton up from this division before joining Huddersfield in 2021. Player of the year in 2022/23.

[TANGODANCER]

I'm liking the looks of Paudie O'Connor, and the asking price range makes him a bargain (I.M.O.)

[irie Cee Bee]

Oof - some damning numbers from Ilesy, at both ends:

"Of the 33 goalkeepers in League One to have made 15 starts this season, Baxter ranks 26th and Southwood 30th for save percentage."

That got my attention. We should let Baxter go. He is not much better than Southwood and I am sure, is on a bigger salary. We need to find a more reliable no. 1. Baxter clearly had bigger ambitions when he joined us. Now he is begging us to keep him. Don't blame him but he is part of the problem.

We may not be able to make wholesale changes due to our budget, but with the little we have, lets fix the defense. We do score goals but concede a whole lot. Johnston, Forrester, Forino should not all be starters if we intend to go up. We now have the opportunity to improve the defending with out of contract Baxter, Jones and Santos. Lets get three better players to replace them.

[Prufrock]

Save percentage is meaningless

[Frank Drebin]

Max Conway wins player of the month for March at Crewe, he also won it in November.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

I'm liking the looks of Paudie O'Connor, and the asking price range makes him a bargain (I.M.O.)

Unless he signs an extension (fairly unlikely) he’ll be on a free transfer. That means he can demand higher wages, bonuses, signing-on fee - but aye, it means we’d owe Lincoln nowt.

[BWFC_Insane]

All signings this summer either need to be under 21 or have played at a higher level for decent time ideally having won promotion from this league.

No mid to late twenties lower league types. Avoid those like the plague.