Team goal of the season - The Guardian awards it to Bolton

[LiOC]

Not sure what the point is.

If you look at all the points we've accumulated since Davo started playing for us, and compare it to only those games when he's missing, points-wise, the "fall off the precipice because Davo isn't playing", doesn't happen. We actually get slightly more points...

I wasn't really trying to argue that though. Just saying that in the games he didn't Play this season I felt that having him on the pitch would've improvednour game. Plus I was only talking about this season. Nevermind

[Prufrock]

So let me get this straight.... your initial argument was that "the two times Davies didn't play we were awful ergo he is crucial to us".

Ok, so the first game you mention, Burnley away, we rested most of the team and indeed Elmander did not play either so I'm not sure any evidence can be taken from that game.

The second game you mention, you are now saying that it was a better performance than the other three games against Wigan where Davies did play. In fact the only time we beat Wigan last season Davies did not play.

Hardly compelling evidence is it. In fact I'd say it suggests more that we could cope without having Davies in the team week in week out, and sometimes we may well be better off!

Ok, I'll admit it was a very flawed argument. My point was more that when he doesn't play there is a very clear Davies sized gap in our attack. You can disagree with that, but whether it's due to us playing through Davies too much or his influence on the game, I genuinely feel if he'd have played the game wouldn't have been so dire.

And when Davies came on, 84th minute or not, it was the first time we looked like a team. It may have been our best performance againt wigan, but we were poor and wigan's team was understrength too.

Not sure what the point is.

If you look at all the points we've accumulated since Davo started playing for us, and compare it to only those games when he's missing, points-wise, the "fall off the precipice because Davo isn't playing", doesn't happen. We actually get slightly more points...

The only period I can remember where we have gone any real length of time without Davo at all was Sammy Lee time. Having a berk in charge didn't help, but neither did having one of our most crucial players. Now I know you aren't arguing this, but I feel the point needs making anyway, whilst the idea we are fooked without Davo may not be true, the idea we won't miss him, or are even being held back by him is complete and utter bollocks.

[CAPSLOCK]

the idea we are being held back by him is complete and utter bollocks.

Just cos you don't agree, it doesn't make it bollocks

The team needs mobile, skilful foitballers up top

Not a carthorse bringing moves to an abrupt end

Just my opinion of course

[Prufrock]

the idea we are being held back by him is complete and utter bollocks.

Just cos you don't agree, it doesn't make it bollocks

The team needs mobile, skilful foitballers up top

Not a carthorse bringing moves to an abrupt end

Just my opinion of course

The fact our other strikers are Ivan 'one kidney' Klasnic, and Robbie 'Owen's Mate' Blake make it bollocks. If we had David Villa and Tevez sat on the bench, or we declined to buy them coz we were saving that spot for Davo then maybe. If we looked like getting even one in better than Davo I'd be chuffed. In his time here he has only ever not been the best forward at the club twice. When Nico was here, and for about six weeks earlier this season. If Davo fooked off, we might get two DJ Campbell and Leroy Lita, then we could play some Tony Mowbray football.

[CAPSLOCK]

Accept most of that, but he was 2nd and 3rd best last season..dunno where 6 weeks comes from

But yes, we've lost Elmander and probably Sturridge

I'd take my chances adding Davies to that list

He;'s looked progessively slower, increasingly ponderous and most worrying at all, disinterested on occasions

I think the game has moved on (not for the better tbf) leaving him behind

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Happy to keep Davo around the place, he gives us a different style. But the fact that he's always the most fouling (urgh) and frequently the most fouled player surely hinders this sweeping counterattacking excitement we're after, no?

[Turkish Trotter]

Davo has been looking past his best lately, would keep him as a different option, but not as captain or a sure starter.
Agree about needing 2 mobile, speedy replacements.

[jimbo]

Happy to keep Davo around the place, he gives us a different style. But the fact that he's always the most fouling (urgh) and frequently the most fouled player surely hinders this sweeping counterattacking excitement we're after, no?

Interestingly this season he surpassed all other seasons with his fouls tally - about 40 more than anyone in the league. At the same time he was nowhere near the top of the list for being fouled, unlike previous seasons. Possibly an indication that he's not quite the handful that he used to be, and so is resorting to fouling more. It also shows that when the ball gets banged up to him, it will more often than not lead to a free kick to the opposition, rather than a potential set piece for us. This again will hinder our attempts to keep the ball, as we're simply giving it straight back to the opposition.

[Lord Kangana]

I don't know how they calculate that, but I don't recall a season where he's won as many freekicks for blatantly diving in all honesty.

Well, perhaps not blatant, but reacting to contact like he's never done before.

[TANGODANCER]

I don't know how they calculate that, but I don't recall a season where he's won as many freekicks for blatantly diving in all honesty. Well, perhaps not blatant, but reacting to contact like he's never done before.

The reason for that's very simple. He's lived on being a hard but basically fair player all his career. Now, every time he gets the ball a defender clatters into the back of him and, if he isn't winning the ball, throws himself in the air, grabs his face and cries foul. With Davo's reputation (cleverly cultivated by the Fergusson's and whining Wengers etc, having a word in the ref's ear about what a dirty player he is) if he wins the ball he's backing in or he gets kicked to fxck, pushed, held down or shirt dragged (come on, how may times has it been complained about on here?), and it gets ignored. He's been far too honest in the past (as he should be if the game was fair) and found it doesn't pay at all. Maybe he's even been told to not be quite so tough about it all?

He's been made what he is by the game, not by himself. If anybody believes otherwise there are a few unclaimed site user names: Lewis Carroll, Hans Christian Anderson and the Brothers Grimm going spare.

[Lord Kangana]

I'm not making a judgement.

I'm merely questioning the validity of the conclusions drawn from the data available.

Its clear he's not the player he was. Which must have made him one hell of a player, based on the easy eulogies thrown out for some of the bog standard players we've had recently.

[TANGODANCER]

I'm not making a judgement.I'm merely questioning the validity of the conclusions drawn from the data available.

Its clear he's not the player he was. Which must have made him one hell of a player, based on the easy eulogies thrown out for some of the bog standard players we've had recently.

Nor me. End of day, he'll leave a massive pair of boots to fill when he finally packs it in. I hope that isn't imminent just yet.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Happy to keep Davo around the place, he gives us a different style. But the fact that he's always the most fouling (urgh) and frequently the most fouled player surely hinders this sweeping counterattacking excitement we're after, no?

Interestingly this season he surpassed all other seasons with his fouls tally - about 40 more than anyone in the league. At the same time he was nowhere near the top of the list for being fouled, unlike previous seasons. Possibly an indication that he's not quite the handful that he used to be, and so is resorting to fouling more. It also shows that when the ball gets banged up to him, it will more often than not lead to a free kick to the opposition, rather than a potential set piece for us. This again will hinder our attempts to keep the ball, as we're simply giving it straight back to the opposition.

Interesting; hadn't noticed that. It does seem to add to the evidence that he's (understandably) slowing up, perhaps being later into tackles, etc. Not that this means he should be taken outside and shot - like I say, he's a gradely weapon to have.

[Lord Kangana]

The B(e)N seems to disagree with some of that:

http://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/sport/wa ... ff/?ref=mr" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Says most fouled again.

[jimbo]

Very quick google tells me that Young (96), Adam (86), Dempsey (77) and Jonas (74) are the most fouled. Davies comes in at 65, meaning he gives away twice as many free kicks as he wins. Whether that is down to referees or his deterioration, we can't have a player who effectively gives the ball away so cheaply every time it is banged up to him.

[Lord Kangana]

B(e)N in being wrong again shocker then.

I am interested in the most fouled team stat though. Is that wrong aswell?

[jimbo]

Quick Google search can't tell me that. I can't imagine it being true, but I've absolutely nothing to back that up with.

[thebish]

the KD "most fouls and most fouled" stat was once true - but has now passed into the general truth category and is - as such - true every season, regardless of what actually happens, because commentators like to throw it in to fill the boredom between all those set-piece goals that we score...

[LiOC]

B(e)N in being wrong again shocker then.
?

Off-topic but "Coyle has been left with just one recognised striker (Kevin Davies) following the departures of Johan Elmander and Daniel Sturridge."
When did Klasnic stop being a recognised striker?! And there's Robbie Blake but I can understand that omission.

Moral of the story-don't trust the Bolton News

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

I'm back in the office tomorrow and may be able to find out most-fouled stats, team and individual.