Muamba can't dance, Steinsson couldn't hit a cows arse

[BWFC_Insane]

Not so Worthy. My judgement is just opinionism and I already accepted ( and stated) KD will come to his career end somewhere shortly. I just try to keep a reality view on who we are and sometimes laugh at the criticism of a guy who's expected to be a one-man army when most of his mates are usually in the other half of the pitch. I'm happy to wait a season or so and see how we do when he isn't there. That's usually when folk start saying how much we miss him now he's gone.

You've really not watched much of us last season have you?

[Lofthouse Lower]

Two years, more like

[TANGODANCER]

Not so Worthy. My judgement is just opinionism and I already accepted ( and stated) KD will come to his career end somewhere shortly. I just try to keep a reality view on who we are and sometimes laugh at the criticism of a guy who's expected to be a one-man army when most of his mates are usually in the other half of the pitch. I'm happy to wait a season or so and see how we do when he isn't there. That's usually when folk start saying how much we miss him now he's gone.

You've really not watched much of us last season have you?

Although not attending, I rarely missed watching a game through some medium or other. Don't go all super-fan on me, I know what footballs all about. Sturridge's presence had KD deeper than normal last season, I'll freely admit, but you were talking over two and a half seasons were you not?

[TANGODANCER]

Two years, more like

Sorry, forgot that being there every homer = football expert. Apologies.

[Lofthouse Lower]

Nope, just entitled to an opinion, like yourself.

[Worthy4England]

Not so Worthy. My judgement is just opinionism and I already accepted ( and stated) KD will come to his career end somewhere shortly. I just try to keep a reality view on who we are and sometimes laugh at the criticism of a guy who's expected to be a one-man army when most of his mates are usually in the other half of the pitch. I'm happy to wait a season or so and see how we do when he isn't there. That's usually when folk start saying how much we miss him now he's gone.

Think it's time to go to Specsavers TD.

There have been many occasions over the last few years when SKD has cut a lone figure, up front in the oppos half, when we've been under the cosh (usually away to top 4 teams). This season, there was a change, not maybe the major change some journos would have you believe - fairly obvious they weren't watching closely either - but some change, in our general approach play. Some of Davo's best contributions this season were with small threaded through passes, rather than the general knock-down headers. Some games, he was so ineffectual, getting nowt of defenders or referees alike, you wondered how he remained on the pitch.

Will we miss him when he's gone - yes - it will cut down an option for us that most other teams don't posess. When he hasn't been available whilst he's been playing for Bolton, our results have improved slightly - so slightly to be of no consequence - but improved slightly nonetheless.

You talk about a "reality view" - that involves being able to see when he's had a bit of a 'mare. Like any other player, he shouldn't be above criticism when he's had a shocker.

[BWFC_Insane]

Not so Worthy. My judgement is just opinionism and I already accepted ( and stated) KD will come to his career end somewhere shortly. I just try to keep a reality view on who we are and sometimes laugh at the criticism of a guy who's expected to be a one-man army when most of his mates are usually in the other half of the pitch. I'm happy to wait a season or so and see how we do when he isn't there. That's usually when folk start saying how much we miss him now he's gone.

You've really not watched much of us last season have you?

Although not attending, I rarely missed watching a game through some medium or other. Don't go all super-fan on me, I know what footballs all about. Sturridge's presence had KD deeper than normal last season, I'll freely admit, but you were talking over two and a half seasons were you not?

My point being that at virtually no point last season was Kevin Davies left "up front on his own as a one man army". I actually think he looks more comfortable when on the rare occassion he is in that role than when he has a partner. But I digress. He's had the support and delivery from the wingers this season.

And W4E is right in his post that some of Davies' little through balls have been excellent. My main criticism of him is since Christmas when he's not been the same player.

[TANGODANCER]

Time, will no doubt reveal all. Now where did I put those glasses.

[Worthy4England]

Time, will no doubt reveal all. Now where did I put those glasses.

Time will not reveal (in time) those occasions when he was poor last season (or any of the preceding seasons). Nor will it reveal anything much else, unless all other factors remain constant - which they won't.

If he retired tomorrow, and we got relegated scoring 32 goals next season, you would put it down to Davies retiring, I'd put it down to no-one replacing Sturridge/Elmander.

How would that prove your point? Other in Tangoworld where everything is painted SKD....

[TANGODANCER]

Time won't also reveal all the occasions we lost because of crap defending rather than didn't win because of attack effort.. I put it all down to the fact we played with what we had, particularly when Holden got taken out and M Davies injured. Up front, Klasnic can't last a game and Blake doesn't seem up to it, Elmander got slated by many despite his efforts and KD just played at the hub of it all week after week. Sturridge made the difference but it's highly unlikely we'll get him back or anyone as good. Had we had Holden I'm pretty certain we'd have got that one extra win for a repectable eighth place.

If we did get relegated I'd be looking at us not being good enough as a team, not ever any one-man thing, that's silly. That's been my main point throughout. KD is just one of eleven. As an aside, I'd actually like to hear the opinion of all the team players on KD. Pretty sure they'd still be more "Great Expectations" than "Bleak House"...but we'll probably never know, that's the Dickens of it..

[Lofthouse Lower]

Onwards and upwards

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Had we had Holden I'm pretty certain we'd have got that one extra win for a respectable eighth place.

After he got stretchered off, we recorded two wins... and eight losses (including the one at OT, which was goalless when he left it).

[Worthy4England]

Time won't also reveal all the occasions we lost because of crap defending rather than didn't win because of attack effort.. I put it all down to the fact we played with what we had, particularly when Holden got taken out and M Davies injured. Up front, Klasnic can't last a game and Blake doesn't seem up to it, Elmander got slated by many despite his efforts and KD just played at the hub of it all week after week. Sturridge made the difference but it's highly unlikely we'll get him back or anyone as good. Had we had Holden I'm pretty certain we'd have got that one extra win for a repectable eighth place.

If we did get relegated I'd be looking at us not being good enough as a team, not ever any one-man thing, that's silly. That's been my main point throughout. KD is just one of eleven. As an aside, I'd actually like to hear the opinion of all the team players on KD. Pretty sure they'd still be more "Great Expectations" than "Bleak House"...but we'll probably never know, that's the Dickens of it..

There's plenty of times we lose because of bad defending or lack of control of midfield, or other things than not scoring enough goals. Sometimes, we're just beaten by a better team. There are occasions when we lose because Elmander didn't hit the target. There are also occasions that we look lacking in front of goals because of SKD.

I'm sure that the other players will tell you he's excellent - but then again, they probably wouldn't slag off other pantomime villans that regularly get slagged on here. None of which detracts from the point that he's prone to have bad games - as are the rest of our team. You just singularly fail to spot any of them when we mention SKD. The problem always lies elsewhere.

[TANGODANCER]

Tango in "SKD sometimes has a far less than perfect game" admission shocker.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

here's plenty of times we lose because of bad defending or lack of control of midfield, or other things than not scoring enough goals.

Damn straight. We've conceded 81 goals in 58 league games under OC, so our "scorers" would have to bag two a game to keep the team winning.

[Wandering Willy]

Tango in "SKD sometimes has a far less than perfect game" admission shocker.

Well feck me with a ragman's trumpet - I've seen it all now.

[Hoboh]

We do need to try another way up top when playing certain teams who with Davo's contibution we rarely get out from and that list is growing. Davies is a good honest grafter who makes the most of what he's got but if we play swift counter attacking football that seems to be the rage Davo is not yer man you need pace and movement.

[Worthy4England]

here's plenty of times we lose because of bad defending or lack of control of midfield, or other things than not scoring enough goals.

Damn straight. We've conceded 81 goals in 58 league games under OC, so our "scorers" would have to bag two a game to keep the team winning.

Aye - needs sorting out. But you always need to look at both ends of the park.

Our "concede rate" under OC at 1.4 isn't too far - but far enough to be a pain - from BSA's average of 1.34 (1.36 in his last season) - works out at 2.2 goals per season difference. HWSNBN was at 1.5 or so and LSL at 1.6. A couple of seasons under Allardyce, we got down to a fraction over 1.

As a counterbalance, our scoring rate at the other end was the best we've seen in the Prem, which is good, but cautionary tales of Blackpool should not be forgotten.

Our GD was the third best we've had in the Prem and I think the point is being made that Sturridge and Elmander contributed significantly to it. Whereas Davo bagged 3? from non-penalties - something for which Taylor was pilloried the season before. If we don't replace Sturridge and Elmander with someone who can put the ball in the net rather regularly, we could be in a whole heap of shite, if Davo doesn't bag more than 3/4.

[William the White]

here's plenty of times we lose because of bad defending or lack of control of midfield, or other things than not scoring enough goals.

Damn straight. We've conceded 81 goals in 58 league games under OC, so our "scorers" would have to bag two a game to keep the team winning.

Aye - needs sorting out. But you always need to look at both ends of the park.

Our "concede rate" under OC at 1.4 isn't too far - but far enough to be a pain - from BSA's average of 1.34 (1.36 in his last season) - works out at 2.2 goals per season difference. HWSNBN was at 1.5 or so and LSL at 1.6. A couple of seasons under Allardyce, we got down to a fraction over 1.

As a counterbalance, our scoring rate at the other end was the best we've seen in the Prem, which is good, but cautionary tales of Blackpool should not be forgotten.

Our GD was the third best we've had in the Prem and I think the point is being made that Sturridge and Elmander contributed significantly to it. Whereas Davo bagged 3? from non-penalties - something for which Taylor was pilloried the season before. If we don't replace Sturridge and Elmander with someone who can put the ball in the net rather regularly, we could be in a whole heap of shite, if Davo doesn't bag more than 3/4.

As impressed as ever by the research...

Absolutely keckin it now...

[boltonboris]

Those are great.

Will it finally put to bed the myth that Muamba can't pass? His pass completion rate is better than Holdens.

Him not being able to shoot isn't a myth though. Christ. I'd back myself to hit the target more often than that.

With about 400 less passes, mind! Only having 770 odd passes in a full almost uninterrupted season in the centre of the park for a team trying to play football is woeful and to me shows that he goes missing in games.

Compare the amount of attempted passes and tackles to Holden and you'll begin to wonder how the American can get to his next birthday without his heart packing in