The TRUTH re Money

[Prufrock]

Shame he plays for Malaga then.

[jimbo_bwfc]

No, I've heard this rumour too.

We're scrapping the team bus next year, they'll be carted round in a Rude Van

[Holden midfielder]

Mssr Coyle is currently winning the information operations battle. Textbook way to manipulate the media and public opinion to achieve your objectives. Brilliant bit of work there fine Sir.

[Lord Kangana]

We've still no money.

Hyperbolic Sun-inspired headlines or no.

[Prufrock]

I've no idea how this is 'the TRUTH re Money'. Now Owen Coyle could be telling the truth and we could have money but don't want to overpay. If that is true then great, and it shows remarkable idealism given we have feck all up front or out wide in a squad belonging to a man who defines himself by 4-4-2 with attacking wingers.

Just, however, consider this. Imagine we have no money...

-...if OC says we have loads of money and are desperate for players, we end up spending silly money on Cameron Jerome.

-...if OC says we are skint and looking for value, clubs come in bidding a tenner for GC knowing we need the cash.

-...OC says we have money but won't be ripped off, we don't need to sell Cahill on the cheap, but we also wont spend silly money.

I'm not saying these quotes mean we have no money, but whilst they are what you would say if you had money, they are also exactly what a shrewd media operator, say with a close pal at a national newspaper he regularly uses to his advantage, would say if he had no money. Or had to maximise sales to get his money.

[Lord Kangana]

Indeed. It wouldn't be in our best interest to say we've no money. All the evidence so far points strongly to us having no money. Or very little. Say, sell before you buy, trim the wage bill a little sort of no money.

[BWFC_Insane]

I've no idea how this is 'the TRUTH re Money'. Now Owen Coyle could be telling the truth and we could have money but don't want to overpay. If that is true then great, and it shows remarkable idealism given we have feck all up front or out wide in a squad belonging to a man who defines himself by 4-4-2 with attacking wingers.

Just, however, consider this. Imagine we have no money...

-...if OC says we have loads of money and are desperate for players, we end up spending silly money on Cameron Jerome.

-...if OC says we are skint and looking for value, clubs come in bidding a tenner for GC knowing we need the cash.

-...OC says we have money but won't be ripped off, we don't need to sell Cahill on the cheap, but we also wont spend silly money.

I'm not saying these quotes mean we have no money, but whilst they are what you would say if you had money, they are also exactly what a shrewd media operator, say with a close pal at a national newspaper he regularly uses to his advantage, would say if he had no money. Or had to maximise sales to get his money.

Its football, if you think other clubs take notice of a manager doing an interview in a local rag and that would influence how they behave towards your club then you are living in cloud cuckoo land. Coyle has explained the situation. If you think he's a liar and Nixon is a liar and it's all just a big conspiracy and Barca are playing their part confirming the Jeffren bid etc then carry on believing. As DSB predicted some folk are determined to disbelieve owt if it suits them!

[Lord Kangana]

I know this is a bit from left field, but have you ever considered that maybe DSB is wrong on this one? No matter how well his opinion is put?

[BWFC_Insane]

Indeed. It wouldn't be in our best interest to say we've no money. All the evidence so far points strongly to us having no money. Or very little. Say, sell before you buy, trim the wage bill a little sort of no money.

Interesting use of the word evidence there, because you seem to be using random opinion as evidence. We could have a hundred million quid to spend and still spend just 3M. Wouldn't mean the hundred million didn't exist. The only real evidence is what Coyle has said in this interview and others, what his media mate Nixon has said and a confirmed 5M bid for Jeffren. That's the evidence, certainy a bit stronger than your guesswork. Especially when the latest interview very directly and explicitly contradicts what you reckon!

[Lord Kangana]

Let me see..

What we've spent = guesswork

Whats been written in the papers = evidence.

Good

and indeed

grief.

[Armchair Wanderer]

As a Bolton fan, albeit of the armchair variety, I'm more than happy with what OC said in this interview.

In 2011 there's just not than much surplus cash knockin' about, let's be prudent for a while...

...as long as we score enough goals this season.

[BWFC_Insane]

Let me see..

What we've spent = guesswork

Whats been written in the papers = evidence.

Good

and indeed

grief.

What Owen Coyle says has a fair bit more weight than what you say.
Your whole argument is based around we haven't spent much so therefore we don't have any money. An interview with the manager contradicts that, he has no need to do so, no need to go into the detail he has here, but he's made very specific comments.

He's a completely unnecessary liar or you're wrong, and I know which my money is on. Though I haven't made a bet yet so in your world it means my bank account must de facto be empty!

[Lord Kangana]

I'm not asking you to believe me.

[Prufrock]

I've no idea how this is 'the TRUTH re Money'. Now Owen Coyle could be telling the truth and we could have money but don't want to overpay. If that is true then great, and it shows remarkable idealism given we have feck all up front or out wide in a squad belonging to a man who defines himself by 4-4-2 with attacking wingers.

Just, however, consider this. Imagine we have no money...

-...if OC says we have loads of money and are desperate for players, we end up spending silly money on Cameron Jerome.

-...if OC says we are skint and looking for value, clubs come in bidding a tenner for GC knowing we need the cash.

-...OC says we have money but won't be ripped off, we don't need to sell Cahill on the cheap, but we also wont spend silly money.

I'm not saying these quotes mean we have no money, but whilst they are what you would say if you had money, they are also exactly what a shrewd media operator, say with a close pal at a national newspaper he regularly uses to his advantage, would say if he had no money. Or had to maximise sales to get his money.

Its football, if you think other clubs take notice of a manager doing an interview in a local rag and that would influence how they behave towards your club then you are living in cloud cuckoo land. Coyle has explained the situation. If you think he's a liar and Nixon is a liar and it's all just a big conspiracy and Barca are playing their part confirming the Jeffren bid etc then carry on believing. As DSB predicted some folk are determined to disbelieve owt if it suits them!

Seriously? Now we all know this isn't football manager right? Other managers don't click a little tab that says 'bid for Gary Cahill'. There are people out there whose jobs are football transfers, agents for clubs, agents for players, club directors, managers, whoever, for whom the odd £500k here, a £1million there makes a difference. In this day and age if you thing clubs (excepting Spurs) just cough up figures coz we ask then I'd suggest it is you living in cloud cuckoo land.

[Prufrock]

Indeed. It wouldn't be in our best interest to say we've no money. All the evidence so far points strongly to us having no money. Or very little. Say, sell before you buy, trim the wage bill a little sort of no money.

Interesting use of the word evidence there, because you seem to be using random opinion as evidence. We could have a hundred million quid to spend and still spend just 3M. Wouldn't mean the hundred million didn't exist. The only real evidence is what Coyle has said in this interview and others, what his media mate Nixon has said and a confirmed 5M bid for Jeffren. That's the evidence, certainy a bit stronger than your guesswork. Especially when the latest interview very directly and explicitly contradicts what you reckon!

The Jeffren we'd been 'watching for 18months' who we only bid £5million for just after we got in a similar amount for Ward and Al-Habsi?

I'm not saying I have proof we have no money, all I'm pointing out is that is is pure bullshit on your part to start posting hyperbolic tabloid threads as if you have proven anything at all. In short, unless you have access to Eddie Davies' bank account details and mood, you have no more idea than we do. For me it 'feels' like we have no money. That comes from the timing of the bids and sales we know were confirmed. Your quotes today are the same thing I manager with money but who wanted to be frugal would say which is the same thing a manager with no money who didn't want people to know would say.

[tell ben im him]

So from that full article today we can gauge that:

- We wont be buying Ngog
- We wont be buying Jerome
- We wont be buying SWP
- We might get Moreno on loan

Still doesnt sound to me the workings of a man being careful with money, but rather someone being told he has no money to spend.

What he's saying is he will pay only what he thinks a player is worth. He spells it out explicitly its exactly how Wenger operates and why they have only signed one player this summer and Arsenal fans are frustrated. On a lower level of course. But let's say Coyle has 8M to spend for arguments sake. And he wants NGog and values him at 3 but Liverpool want 6, the point he's making is that whilst we could pay 6 he won't because it wouldn't get him the best value. He's doing the exact opposite of Megson, who identified who he wanted and paid the price required to get them. Pratley a prime example we could have bought him two or three times in the past for several million, he's a player Coyle wanted but because Coyle wanted value for the deal we waited until either Swansea priced him at something Coyle agreed with or he was on a free. It's a different way of doing things to what weve been used to with Megson and to some extent Allardyce. End of the day might make for some frustrating times not getting certain players but equally the Jeffren bid shows that when he thinks the deal is right he is prepared to commit the money when appropriate.

lets hope we dont end up one of the richest clubs in the championship then, if i,m selling a car for 3 grand and you offer me a grand i will politely tell you to go fcuk yourself and keep it till i get a better offer. meanwhile back at the bus stop your getting piss wet through, but there will be a bus along soon wont there?

[BWFC_Insane]

Indeed. It wouldn't be in our best interest to say we've no money. All the evidence so far points strongly to us having no money. Or very little. Say, sell before you buy, trim the wage bill a little sort of no money.

Interesting use of the word evidence there, because you seem to be using random opinion as evidence. We could have a hundred million quid to spend and still spend just 3M. Wouldn't mean the hundred million didn't exist. The only real evidence is what Coyle has said in this interview and others, what his media mate Nixon has said and a confirmed 5M bid for Jeffren. That's the evidence, certainy a bit stronger than your guesswork. Especially when the latest interview very directly and explicitly contradicts what you reckon!

The Jeffren we'd been 'watching for 18months' who we only bid £5million for just after we got in a similar amount for Ward and Al-Habsi?

I'm not saying I have proof we have no money, all I'm pointing out is that is is pure bullshit on your part to start posting hyperbolic tabloid threads as if you have proven anything at all. In short, unless you have access to Eddie Davies' bank account details and mood, you have no more idea than we do. For me it 'feels' like we have no money. That comes from the timing of the bids and sales we know were confirmed. Your quotes today are the same thing I manager with money but who wanted to be frugal would say which is the same thing a manager with no money who didn't want people to know would say.

Aye but you are making an assumption that we only bid for Jeffren when it hit the press. It's equally as likely the it only came to light once Barca had realised they couldn't use him as swap bait in the Sancshez deal, or that we only moved for him when our bid for Rodrigo was knocked back.

As for evidence I still think quite a detailed Owen Coyle interview in the Bolton News, hardly what I'd call a tabloid gutter press publication, with actual direct Coyle quotes is pretty good evidence.

And if we allow the wacky theory that he's telling porkies so that clubs don't think we are skint and offer up pennies for Cahill, the opposite scenario is equally true, make out you're not skint as he has and surely then sitting down with agents to sign their players becomes very difficult when they want a slice of that pie that you've already told them is quite healthy but you're just a 'bit tight'.

[BL3]

if i,m selling a car for 3 grand and you offer me a grand i will politely tell you to go fcuk yourself and keep it till i get a better offer. meanwhile back at the bus stop your getting piss wet through, but there will be a bus along soon wont there?

...and your 'car' continues to depreciate in value. It works both ways.

Prices will come down towards the end of the transfer window when clubs realise that if they don't sell, then they'll be stuck with players they don't really need.

It's always the same. Clubs have months to get deals done and yet they're desperately trying to register players 5 minutes before the transfer window shuts... or in Arsenal's case, 5 weeks after it's already closed.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Apparently, direct Coyle quotes saying he has money are now less "evidence" than LK's ITK.

It's an unwinnable argument. Common sense long since got its head sat on by hearsay and guesswork.

[thebish]

lets hope we dont end up one of the richest clubs in the championship then, if i,m selling a car for 3 grand and you offer me a grand i will politely tell you to go fcuk yourself and keep it till i get a better offer. meanwhile back at the bus stop your getting piss wet through, but there will be a bus along soon wont there?

hmmm.... you'd be an ebay dream! If I'm offering a 1986 Ford Cortina (with some rust) with a reserve of £35,000 - and you wanted to avoid getting wet - you'd pay that?


Coyle isn't saying anything controversial here. In your car scenario - if your car actually IS worth 3 grand (in Coyle's estimation) - then he'd buy it - he would soend the money. He is not advocating offering LESS than someone is worth (in his estimation) - just telling us he's not going to pay well over the odds. that's all - not really a story... in other words - he's not Roy Keane buying Craig Gordon...