poll where are the people who think OC is any good

[Sponge]

I'm not criticising.

I just don't think Owen has used money well at all. We'd have been better off keeping the 3M in our pockets than spending on a player who hasn't kicked a ball in anger since January, and who is proably right royally pissed off.

I don't think he has a very clear strategy for how to use our resources and whilst he may have picked up a couple of decent free transfers I don't think he's spent money at all well.

Its still not his biggest failing, which is his inability to organise a group of players to get the best out of them consistently.

In fact I'm struggling to think what he is actually good at. The much fabled "good football" doesn't stack up, I can't remember us playing anything remotely like an exciting style of football this season. In fact I still think the best football we've played was Mark Davies first home game against Spurs under Megson. I don't think we've got close to that level since.

Eh? Not got close? We played some excellent football in the first half of last season – you know, when Coyle was (ludicrously) being touted as Wenger's replacement.

Regarding Sordell. It depends. Perhaps he was a player he had in mind to buy in the summer, saw that Cardiff were going in for him, and was forced to make a move. 3 million in Janurary or 3 million in the summer – it doesn't make much difference.

If you don't have much money and are in the relegation zone, should you really be buying a player you don't intend on playing till the next season?

Its quite ludicrous.

If we were mid table and in no real danger of relegation and losing 25M then spending the money in that way would be fine.

The truth is that January was our chance to dig ourselves out. If we had no money and couldn't then fine. But to spend a significant fee on a player who wasn't going to be involved....ridiculous.

As our chum Nixon said, buying Sordell wasn't at the expense of other signings. We tried for several but they didn't come off. That's how it goes. There's no doubt things are much more difficult in the transfer market for a club like us than they were in Allardyce's time (and are getting harder every year). And Sordell is proven in the Championship, so if we are relegated he'll likely prove a very good signing. Don't really see what you complaining about. (Though I too would like to have seen him play more, I'll trust the people who see him train everyday to decide when he's ready.)

And don't you think we played some very good football at the beginning of last season? Tottenham? Wolves? Newcastle? Some of the best I've seen since the 1996/97 season in Division One.

[BWFC_Insane]

I'm not criticising.

I just don't think Owen has used money well at all. We'd have been better off keeping the 3M in our pockets than spending on a player who hasn't kicked a ball in anger since January, and who is proably right royally pissed off.

I don't think he has a very clear strategy for how to use our resources and whilst he may have picked up a couple of decent free transfers I don't think he's spent money at all well.

Its still not his biggest failing, which is his inability to organise a group of players to get the best out of them consistently.

In fact I'm struggling to think what he is actually good at. The much fabled "good football" doesn't stack up, I can't remember us playing anything remotely like an exciting style of football this season. In fact I still think the best football we've played was Mark Davies first home game against Spurs under Megson. I don't think we've got close to that level since.

Eh? Not got close? We played some excellent football in the first half of last season – you know, when Coyle was (ludicrously) being touted as Wenger's replacement.

Regarding Sordell. It depends. Perhaps he was a player he had in mind to buy in the summer, saw that Cardiff were going in for him, and was forced to make a move. 3 million in Janurary or 3 million in the summer – it doesn't make much difference.

If you don't have much money and are in the relegation zone, should you really be buying a player you don't intend on playing till the next season?

Its quite ludicrous.

If we were mid table and in no real danger of relegation and losing 25M then spending the money in that way would be fine.

The truth is that January was our chance to dig ourselves out. If we had no money and couldn't then fine. But to spend a significant fee on a player who wasn't going to be involved....ridiculous.

As our chum Nixon said, buying Sordell wasn't at the expense of other signings. We tried for several but they didn't come off. That's how it goes. There's no doubt things are much more difficult in the transfer market for a club like us than they were in Allardyce's time (and are getting harder every year). And Sordell is proven in the Championship, so if we are relegated he'll likely prove a very good signing. Don't really see what you complaining about. (Though I too would like to have seen him play more, I'll trust the people who see him train everyday to decide when he's ready.)

And don't you think we played some very good football at the beginning of last season? Tottenham? Wolves? Newcastle? Some of the best I've seen since the 1996/97 season in Division One.

If we're going on what Nixon said he was also asked why Coyle wasn't going for Sigurdsson in Jan and the response was "because he doesn't rate him".

So I'm not sure that paints our manager in a great light either given how things have worked out.

I'm not buying your argument. There may well have not been any players we could buy. (Though evidently other clubs managed to find ones to make an impact, Sigurdsson, Pobgrebnyak, Beausejour etc) But you don't then spend 3M for the sake of it on someone who doesn't feature at all.

Everything that happened in January EVERYTHING should have been focussed around giving us the best chance of staying up. Nowt else mattered at that stage. NOWT!

[Sponge]

I'm not criticising.

I just don't think Owen has used money well at all. We'd have been better off keeping the 3M in our pockets than spending on a player who hasn't kicked a ball in anger since January, and who is proably right royally pissed off.

I don't think he has a very clear strategy for how to use our resources and whilst he may have picked up a couple of decent free transfers I don't think he's spent money at all well.

Its still not his biggest failing, which is his inability to organise a group of players to get the best out of them consistently.

In fact I'm struggling to think what he is actually good at. The much fabled "good football" doesn't stack up, I can't remember us playing anything remotely like an exciting style of football this season. In fact I still think the best football we've played was Mark Davies first home game against Spurs under Megson. I don't think we've got close to that level since.

Eh? Not got close? We played some excellent football in the first half of last season – you know, when Coyle was (ludicrously) being touted as Wenger's replacement.

Regarding Sordell. It depends. Perhaps he was a player he had in mind to buy in the summer, saw that Cardiff were going in for him, and was forced to make a move. 3 million in Janurary or 3 million in the summer – it doesn't make much difference.

If you don't have much money and are in the relegation zone, should you really be buying a player you don't intend on playing till the next season?

Its quite ludicrous.

If we were mid table and in no real danger of relegation and losing 25M then spending the money in that way would be fine.

The truth is that January was our chance to dig ourselves out. If we had no money and couldn't then fine. But to spend a significant fee on a player who wasn't going to be involved....ridiculous.

As our chum Nixon said, buying Sordell wasn't at the expense of other signings. We tried for several but they didn't come off. That's how it goes. There's no doubt things are much more difficult in the transfer market for a club like us than they were in Allardyce's time (and are getting harder every year). And Sordell is proven in the Championship, so if we are relegated he'll likely prove a very good signing. Don't really see what you complaining about. (Though I too would like to have seen him play more, I'll trust the people who see him train everyday to decide when he's ready.)

And don't you think we played some very good football at the beginning of last season? Tottenham? Wolves? Newcastle? Some of the best I've seen since the 1996/97 season in Division One.

If we're going on what Nixon said he was also asked why Coyle wasn't going for Sigurdsson in Jan and the response was "because he doesn't rate him".

So I'm not sure that paints our manager in a great light either given how things have worked out.

I'm not buying your argument. There may well have not been any players we could buy. (Though evidently other clubs managed to find ones to make an impact, Sigurdsson, Pobgrebnyak, Beausejour etc) But you don't then spend 3M for the sake of it on someone who doesn't feature at all.

Everything that happened in January EVERYTHING should have been focussed around giving us the best chance of staying up. Nowt else mattered at that stage. NOWT!

You could equally criticise the other eighteen managers in the league for not signing Sigurdsson.

[norm the jedi]

You could equally criticise the other eighteen managers in the league for not signing Sigurdsson.

not really, possibly the six or seven up to their necks in a relegation battle but I don't think the top 6 needed to get involved..

[BWFC_Insane]

Put it this way, if as a manager of an organisation you were aware of a potential risk to the organisation that if it happened would mean it losing around about £25M.

And you had a risk budget of £3M.

Would you
a) spend the £3M on risk mitigation acitivities in the hope that you avoided losing the £25M.
b) decide that with your risk budget there was little you could do to mitigate the risk and ride it out £3M in tact. Essentially, do nothing.
c) spend the £3M on activities or resources that would in no way mitigate the risk.

Only two of those responses are valid business options.

Only two of them might let you avoid the sack.

[newboy]

If we're going on what Nixon said he was also asked why Coyle wasn't going for Sigurdsson in Jan and the response was "because he doesn't rate him".

So I'm not sure that paints our manager in a great light either given how things have worked out.

I'm not buying your argument. There may well have not been any players we could buy. (Though evidently other clubs managed to find ones to make an impact, Sigurdsson, Pobgrebnyak, Beausejour etc) But you don't then spend 3M for the sake of it on someone who doesn't feature at all.

Everything that happened in January EVERYTHING should have been focussed around giving us the best chance of staying up. Nowt else mattered at that stage. NOWT!

Nail hit firmly on the head the Sordell wasn't ready for the prem scenario doesn't wash What about Ream or Myachi in Reams case that excuse doesn't hold water why spend that sort of money on a player if you're never going to play him? It's a survival game whoever is brought in has add to the team and has to hit the ground running anything else is just total stupidity

[Hoboh]

I'm not criticising.

I just don't think Owen has used money well at all. We'd have been better off keeping the 3M in our pockets than spending on a player who hasn't kicked a ball in anger since January, and who is proably right royally pissed off.

I don't think he has a very clear strategy for how to use our resources and whilst he may have picked up a couple of decent free transfers I don't think he's spent money at all well.

Its still not his biggest failing, which is his inability to organise a group of players to get the best out of them consistently.

In fact I'm struggling to think what he is actually good at. The much fabled "good football" doesn't stack up, I can't remember us playing anything remotely like an exciting style of football this season. In fact I still think the best football we've played was Mark Davies first home game against Spurs under Megson. I don't think we've got close to that level since.

Eh? Not got close? We played some excellent football in the first half of last season – you know, when Coyle was (ludicrously) being touted as Wenger's replacement.

Regarding Sordell. It depends. Perhaps he was a player he had in mind to buy in the summer, saw that Cardiff were going in for him, and was forced to make a move. 3 million in Janurary or 3 million in the summer – it doesn't make much difference.

If you don't have much money and are in the relegation zone, should you really be buying a player you don't intend on playing till the next season?

Its quite ludicrous.

If we were mid table and in no real danger of relegation and losing 25M then spending the money in that way would be fine.

The truth is that January was our chance to dig ourselves out. If we had no money and couldn't then fine. But to spend a significant fee on a player who wasn't going to be involved....ridiculous.

As our chum Nixon said, buying Sordell wasn't at the expense of other signings. We tried for several but they didn't come off. That's how it goes. There's no doubt things are much more difficult in the transfer market for a club like us than they were in Allardyce's time (and are getting harder every year). And Sordell is proven in the Championship, so if we are relegated he'll likely prove a very good signing. Don't really see what you complaining about. (Though I too would like to have seen him play more, I'll trust the people who see him train everyday to decide when he's ready.)
And don't you think we played some very good football at the beginning of last season? Tottenham? Wolves? Newcastle? Some of the best I've seen since the 1996/97 season in Division One.

I'd have more faith in the lookout and Captain of the titanic.
Seriously you'd trust a bunch of people and the leader who have failed on more levels than your avg New York skyscraper?
Coyle is crap, his chosen few are crap and I suspect that by the time he fecks off back to Scotland the club will be in bigger crap than Megson left it in!
I'd have more faith in a "Blackadder cuning plan" than anything Coyle thinks.

[Bruce Rioja]

Put it this way, if as a manager of an organisation you were aware of a potential risk to the organisation that if it happened would mean it losing around about £25M.

This idea that we'll "lose" £25m is as big a sack of absolute bollocks as it is to say that promotion to the PL is worth £60m (or whatever figures currently being bandied about. Expenditure expands and contracts with income!

[BWFC_Insane]

Put it this way, if as a manager of an organisation you were aware of a potential risk to the organisation that if it happened would mean it losing around about £25M.

This idea that we'll "lose" £25m is as big a sack of absolute bollocks as it is to say that promotion to the PL is worth £60m (or whatever figures currently being bandied about. Expenditure expands and contracts with income!

I'm only using the Deloitte analysis.

And as for the bolded bit, football history in many cases says otherwise......

[Lord Kangana]

Quite correct. Our own recent history says otherwise.

[Sponge]

Put it this way, if as a manager of an organisation you were aware of a potential risk to the organisation that if it happened would mean it losing around about £25M.

And you had a risk budget of £3M.

Would you
a) spend the £3M on risk mitigation acitivities in the hope that you avoided losing the £25M.
b) decide that with your risk budget there was little you could do to mitigate the risk and ride it out £3M in tact. Essentially, do nothing.
c) spend the £3M on activities or resources that would in no way mitigate the risk.

Only two of those responses are valid business options.

Only two of them might let you avoid the sack.

While buying Sordell hasn't increased our chances of staying up this season (unless he scores the winner tomorrow), it's equally true that buying him hasn't increased our chances of going down (assuming Nixon's correct and buying him didn't have any affect on our other potential signings).

On another thread you said we'll have to buy players if we're relegated (as we'll have to buy players if we stay up); so what difference does it make if that 3 million is spent in January 2011 or July 2012?

[BWFC_Insane]

Put it this way, if as a manager of an organisation you were aware of a potential risk to the organisation that if it happened would mean it losing around about £25M.

And you had a risk budget of £3M.

Would you
a) spend the £3M on risk mitigation acitivities in the hope that you avoided losing the £25M.
b) decide that with your risk budget there was little you could do to mitigate the risk and ride it out £3M in tact. Essentially, do nothing.
c) spend the £3M on activities or resources that would in no way mitigate the risk.

Only two of those responses are valid business options.

Only two of them might let you avoid the sack.

While buying Sordell hasn't increased our chances of staying up this season (unless he scores the winner tomorrow), it's equally true that buying him hasn't increased our chances of going down (assuming Nixon's correct and buying him didn't have any affect on our other potential signings).

On another thread you said we'll have to buy players if we're relegated (as we'll have to buy players if we stay up); so what difference does it make if that 3 million is spent in January 2011 or July 2012?

If buying Sordell did not impact on our ability to sign other players, then I'm assuming there is a big pot of money to buy those other players with now? I look forwards to a summer full of bumper deals!

[norm the jedi]

Put it this way, if as a manager of an organisation you were aware of a potential risk to the organisation that if it happened would mean it losing around about £25M.

And you had a risk budget of £3M.

Would you
a) spend the £3M on risk mitigation acitivities in the hope that you avoided losing the £25M.
b) decide that with your risk budget there was little you could do to mitigate the risk and ride it out £3M in tact. Essentially, do nothing.
c) spend the £3M on activities or resources that would in no way mitigate the risk.

Only two of those responses are valid business options.

Only two of them might let you avoid the sack.

The basic model of risk management [well one of em but they're broadly similar is the RARAT approach snappy heh?
R - Reduce
A - Avoid
R - Remove
A - Accept
T - Transfer

I would suggest that buying Sordell could be seen as accepting the risk of relegation but remaining on your present course with the addition of some insurance to assist in a future restructuring if the loss occurs or strengthen as he develops in the present league next term..

your model predicates the belief that doing nothing will result in the loss, Coyle would view this as a massive negative assumption whilst arguing that we had enough to get us out of it without panic buying in a broadly overpriced dodgy January market where lets face it we all remember the hits but they are dwarfed by the misses.

Short view v long view.. but their are 5 options or variations which amount to the above.

[BWFC_Insane]

Put it this way, if as a manager of an organisation you were aware of a potential risk to the organisation that if it happened would mean it losing around about £25M.

And you had a risk budget of £3M.

Would you
a) spend the £3M on risk mitigation acitivities in the hope that you avoided losing the £25M.
b) decide that with your risk budget there was little you could do to mitigate the risk and ride it out £3M in tact. Essentially, do nothing.
c) spend the £3M on activities or resources that would in no way mitigate the risk.

Only two of those responses are valid business options.

Only two of them might let you avoid the sack.

The basic model of risk management [well one of em but they're broadly similar is the RARAT approach snappy heh?
R - Reduce
A - Avoid
R - Remove
A - Accept
T - Transfer

I would suggest that buying Sordell could be seen as accepting the risk of relegation but remaining on your present course with the addition of some insurance to assist in a future restructuring if the loss occurs or strengthen as he develops in the present league next term..

your model predicates the belief that doing nothing will result in the loss, Coyle would view this as a massive negative assumption whilst arguing that we had enough to get us out of it without panic buying in a broadly overpriced dodgy January market where lets face it we all remember the hits but they are dwarfed by the misses.

Short view v long view.. but their are 5 options or variations which amount to the above.

I think the only thing my model assumes is that the £3M was part of a risk budget. Now if it wasn't then your accept risk response could be valid.

The do nothing approach is accepting the risk and dealing with it either way when the result happens.

You wouldn't spend your risk budget on activities not related to mitigating that risk. If the 3M was not part of the risk budget then again I look forwards to our bumper spending activities this summer!

[Lord Kangana]

£3m gets you bugger all these days.

So £3m on a young, promising, much-polishing-needed England U21 with good potential for resale value, and probably not on a whopping contract, represents a far better approach than £3m and £50k in wages on a not-likely-to-do-it-for-more-than-6-months-but-will-want-a-minimum-2-year-deal has been. Under the current, parsimonious, circumstances.

[RedStarBelgrade]

http://sport.blic.rs/Fudbal/Domaci-fudb ... i-u-Bolton" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

According to Serbian newspapers "Blic" Grant is coming to Bolton at the end of the season

[boltonboris]

According to Talksport, Jay Jay Okocha will be replacing Coyle at the end of the season....

[Bruce Rioja]

According to Talksport, Jay Jay Okocha will be replacing Coyle at the end of the season....

I bet he's got a full repertoire of trick ping-pong shots

[Lord Kangana]

Nevermind that, another one outed as a Talksport listener....

[boltonboris]

Haha... It was actually 'TeamTalk'. I apologise. I view or listen to neither..

I saw it on twitter