Is it time yet?

[TKIZ!]

This is it for me, a loss tonight & I'm officially giving him no more chances. It's daft to put everything on one match of course but there has to be a line in the sand somewhere. Truth be told I already have no remaining hope he has what it takes hidden away somewhere in reserve which just hasn't been showing through (in a long, long time). There have been unfortunate decisions against us recently but it's no excuse when you've been here for long enough to put together a finished product. He's been given chance upon chance upon chance & there has to come a point where he gets no more.

So to my mind this is it. I don't think a draw here, & then maybe even a win at Millwall, will prove that after all he can do it but as a line in the sand: a loss at home tonight would be the straw that broke the camels back & his time should be up.

Couldn't have put it more articulately if I'd tried. No wonder you do podcasts.

However will say this, it will do nobody any good at all if even before the ball is kicked the crowd are on the team's back. Let's at least wait till we're a couple of goals down for that

[Joggers Nipple]

The mystery for me is what's gone wrong? The first 18 months of his tenure was excellent, everything was exciting & positive (remember Newc 5-1) - and a blessed relief from the negative atmosphere surrounding the Megson era. Whereas the last 18 months regardless of the crippling injury list has been dull, tedious & predictable.

The only explanation I can think of is he's lost the dressing room and if so then he must go now before we go down another division which is a real shame cos I thought Coyle was our long term solution.

[truewhite15]

The mystery for me is what's gone wrong? The first 18 months of his tenure was excellent, everything was exciting & positive (remember Newc 5-1) - and a blessed relief from the negative atmosphere surrounding the Megson era. Whereas the last 18 months regardless of the crippling injury list has been dull, tedious & predictable.

The only explanation I can think of is he's lost the dressing room and if so then he must go now before we go down another division which is a real shame cos I thought Coyle was our long term solution.

He got found out. It's as simple as that. He is incredibly stubborn and narrow-minded when it comes to tactics and formation. He has developed a career out of coming into a club, boosting the general attitude and morale to stratospheric levels, and then getting them to play well off that alone. Which is great. But when an event like Wembley comes along, and knocks the stuffing out of the players mentality-wise, he has absolutely no clue how to re-install the confidence that made them great. Whenever this sort of thing happened in the past, he just jumped ship to another club. He's never had to deal with a collapse of confidence and form before, and he's not got the foggiest how to reverse it.

[Dartisan]

This is it for me, a loss tonight & I'm officially giving him no more chances. It's daft to put everything on one match of course but there has to be a line in the sand somewhere. Truth be told I already have no remaining hope he has what it takes hidden away somewhere in reserve which just hasn't been showing through (in a long, long time). There have been unfortunate decisions against us recently but it's no excuse when you've been here for long enough to put together a finished product. He's been given chance upon chance upon chance & there has to come a point where he gets no more.

So to my mind this is it. I don't think a draw here, & then maybe even a win at Millwall, will prove that after all he can do it but as a line in the sand: a loss at home tonight would be the straw that broke the camels back & his time should be up.

Couldn't have put it more articulately if I'd tried. No wonder you do podcasts.

However will say this, it will do nobody any good at all if even before the ball is kicked the crowd are on the team's back. Let's at least wait till we're a couple of goals down for that

Why thank you

And I'm completely with you on the crowd staying behind the team. As much as I'm sick of Coyle's failings, & as much as I understand the frustrations of our supporters, personally I will never let my dissatisfaction with a manager overpower my desire for us to succeed on the pitch. I still want us to beat Leeds & if we do, brilliant. If we then beat Millwall, brilliant. This is his last chance for me but it remains a chance nonetheless. Given how far we are from the '2 points per game' we perhaps should be achieving though he pretty much needs to win the next 5 on the trot to persuade me.

[Wandering Willy]

We'll know as soon as we see the teamsheet tonight whether Coyle has learnt any lessons at all.

What am I saying - of course he won't.

No more chances.

[Bruce Rioja]

Couldn't have put it more articulately if I'd tried.

Correct

[CAPSLOCK]

The mystery for me is what's gone wrong? The first 18 months of his tenure was excellent, everything was exciting & positive (remember Newc 5-1) - and a blessed relief from the negative atmosphere surrounding the Megson era. Whereas the last 18 months regardless of the crippling injury list has been dull, tedious & predictable.

The only explanation I can think of is he's lost the dressing room and if so then he must go now before we go down another division which is a real shame cos I thought Coyle was our long term solution.

I do remember Newcastle

I remember it cos it was one a few exciting displays

He can have Spurs, Wolves and Blackpool around that time, too (we did our best to lose all 3 of those buggers)

Other than that, its been same old, same old

And the last season and abit has been dogshit

He's stolen a living since at least the beginning of last season

His selections

His (cash) signings have been, almost to a man, failures

his 'tactics' such as you can call them tactics

His substitutions

The man is a cock and tonights result should have no bearing whatsoever on his job security

[Dartisan]

The mystery for me is what's gone wrong? The first 18 months of his tenure was excellent, everything was exciting & positive (remember Newc 5-1) - and a blessed relief from the negative atmosphere surrounding the Megson era. Whereas the last 18 months regardless of the crippling injury list has been dull, tedious & predictable.

The only explanation I can think of is he's lost the dressing room and if so then he must go now before we go down another division which is a real shame cos I thought Coyle was our long term solution.

He got found out. It's as simple as that. He is incredibly stubborn and narrow-minded when it comes to tactics and formation. He has developed a career out of coming into a club, boosting the general attitude and morale to stratospheric levels, and then getting them to play well off that alone. Which is great. But when an event like Wembley comes along, and knocks the stuffing out of the players mentality-wise, he has absolutely no clue how to re-install the confidence that made them great. Whenever this sort of thing happened in the past, he just jumped ship to another club. He's never had to deal with a collapse of confidence and form before, and he's not got the foggiest how to reverse it.

A piece we did on the Podcast made me realize it's not actually quite as clear-cut as this. In September '08 (the 13th to be precise) Burnley were 19th after 5 matches, having secured just 5 points. Coyle had taken them there, he'd been manager for almost a year at that point (since November '07). Burnley went on to secure promotion that season, winning the play-offs. I don't think that can be put down to 'new manager syndrome', he'd been there too long.

For me what went wrong is Coyle has never been able to adapt to an era where 4-4-2 is not the be-all-and-end-all. An era where a much more holisitc & pragmatic approach to operating things is required. An era where everybody has learnt from Big Sam's more dynamic approach to football.

I had one big fear when we appointed Coyle: the fear that he was overly focused on attack & not good at putting out a team which could defend well, a team which could work from the back forwards. Unfortunately I think I was on the mark, & his struggles to adapt have floundered.

[CAPSLOCK]

I had one big fear when we appointed Coyle: the fear that he was overly focused on attack & not good at putting out a team which could defend well, a team which could work from the back forwards. Unfortunately I think I was on the mark, & his struggles to adapt have floundered.

We don't even attack well

[BWFC_Insane]

The mystery for me is what's gone wrong? The first 18 months of his tenure was excellent, everything was exciting & positive (remember Newc 5-1) - and a blessed relief from the negative atmosphere surrounding the Megson era. Whereas the last 18 months regardless of the crippling injury list has been dull, tedious & predictable.

The only explanation I can think of is he's lost the dressing room and if so then he must go now before we go down another division which is a real shame cos I thought Coyle was our long term solution.

I do remember Newcastle

I remember it cos it was one a few exciting displays

He can have Spurs, Wolves and Blackpool around that time, too (we did our best to lose all 3 of those buggers)

Other than that, its been same old, same old

And the last season and abit has been dogshit

He's stolen a living since at least the beginning of last season

His selections

His (cash) signings have been, almost to a man, failures

his 'tactics' such as you can call them tactics

His substitutions

The man is a cock and tonights result should have no bearing whatsoever on his job security

Aye for all the talk of "better football", I've seen no evidence of Coyle producing a better product to watch than Megson did.

And we are not seemingly bringing young players through either.....

[boltonboris]

Voted the 10th worst manager in Premier League history according to Football365..

Probably a bit harsh..

[Lord Kangana]

His first full season was way better than anything Megson ever put out. Lets not talk shite. And we were going down when he replaced him, so it was a nice reprieve.

Beyond that, its gone wrong. Its time for change. But, you know, you're getting all misty eyed for a complete w*nker who started this slide.

[TKIZ!]

Couldn't have put it more articulately if I'd tried.

Correct

Word Nazi

[CAPSLOCK]

His first full season was way better than anything Megson ever put out. Lets not talk shite. And we were going down when he replaced him, so it was a nice reprieve.

Beyond that, its gone wrong. Its time for change. But, you know, you're getting all misty eyed for a complete w*nker who started this slide.

I'm no fan of Allardyce or Lee but that's harsh

Weren't we 3 points from 12th when Megson went

I'd take that, now, even in Division 2

[TKIZ!]

Voted the 10th worst manager in Premier League history according to Football365..

Probably a bit harsh..

There are for me way more managers who've been terrible in the Premier League (Roy McFarland, Roy Keane, Mark Hughes)

[BWFC_Insane]

His first full season was way better than anything Megson ever put out. Lets not talk shite. And we were going down when he replaced him, so it was a nice reprieve.

Beyond that, its gone wrong. Its time for change. But, you know, you're getting all misty eyed for a complete w*nker who started this slide.

We're not. Nobody in their right mind would pick Megson to come back.

Point is, its got worse.

And that first season ended up a place below where we'd finished the season before.

It had started well, granted. And Sturridge coming in stopped us slipping into a relegation battle (prior to Sturridge coming in we were dangerously slipping). And lets remember, Sturridge came cos Carlos Vela (Ahem) turned us down.

There were worrying signs that season, particularly the end. One could almost argue that it was the first real test of Coyle as a manager when things weren't just rolling with momentum.

[BWFC_Insane]

Voted the 10th worst manager in Premier League history according to Football365..

Probably a bit harsh..

There are for me way more managers who've been terrible in the Premier League (Roy McFarland, Roy Keane, Mark Hughes)

Jeesus christ. A million zillion times above Owen Coyle. I'd take Hughes as our manager any day.

EDIT.

In his full seasons at Blackburn Hughes' team finished....

6th in the premiership, qualified for the UEFA cup.
10th in the premiership
7th in the premiership

At Fulham

8th in the premiership

Clubs analagous to ourselves.

Perhaps you could point out, the evidence to suggest Owen Coyle is a better manager?

[Dartisan]

I had one big fear when we appointed Coyle: the fear that he was overly focused on attack & not good at putting out a team which could defend well, a team which could work from the back forwards. Unfortunately I think I was on the mark, & his struggles to adapt have floundered.

We don't even attack well

True, he's regressed!

[CAPSLOCK]

I'm not sure

But this is likely arguing over whether its better to get white or brown shit on your shoes

[boltonboris]

You don't see white shit anymore