Margaret Thatcher, R.I.P.?

[mummywhycantieatcrayons]

Exactly - as someone said "We've got all this kit lying around- we may as well use it."

[Lost Leopard Spot]

I think you missed the bathos. And the irony. And the sarcasm. But hey ho.

[mummywhycantieatcrayons]

and - it's mummy (not you) who said it should happen for Maggie but not for Tony...

I didn't say that. I said that Thatcher's case was far stronger but that I could see the argument for Blair.

i believe you said it felt right for thatcher but wouldn't feel right for blair because his war wasn't as well won as hers...

I can see a case for Blair, three-term, Clause 4-scrapping, Good Friday Agreement-securing Prime Minister to have a St Paul's funeral.

I don't think there would be as many people strongly in favour of it as there were for Thatcher. I also think Blair's war, not one that involved British territory or the self determiantion of British citizens, is not likely to count in the 'plus' column when thinking about military honours, partly because of the way people feel his was dishonest in the lead-up to Iraq.

Is any of this incoherent?

[thebish]

Exactly - as someone said "We've got all this kit lying around- we may as well use it."

if that's the basic argument - that it basically costs nowt to be worried about and the stuff is there to be used - then I regularly do funerals for ace people who have lived ace lives and done ace things... I await the legislation that enables me to call upon the services of our armed forces and policemen who are sat about just waiting for someone to give them summat to do!

[thebish]

I can see a case for Blair, three-term, Clause 4-scrapping, Good Friday Agreement-securing Prime Minister to have a St Paul's funeral.

I don't think there would be as many people strongly in favour of it as there were for Thatcher. I also think Blair's war, not one that involved British territory or the self determiantion of British citizens, is not likely to count in the 'plus' column when thinking about military honours, partly because of the way people feel his was dishonest in the lead-up to Iraq.

Is any of this incoherent?

no - but if I am honest, to me, it really just sounds like partisanship-dressed-as-lamb!

[mummywhycantieatcrayons]

I can see a case for Blair, three-term, Clause 4-scrapping, Good Friday Agreement-securing Prime Minister to have a St Paul's funeral.

I don't think there would be as many people strongly in favour of it as there were for Thatcher. I also think Blair's war, not one that involved British territory or the self determiantion of British citizens, is not likely to count in the 'plus' column when thinking about military honours, partly because of the way people feel his was dishonest in the lead-up to Iraq.

Is any of this incoherent?

no - but if I am honest, to me, it really just sounds like partisanship-dressed-as-lamb!

I would be perfectly relaxed about Blair having some kind of ceremonial funeral. What is partisan about that?

[mummywhycantieatcrayons]

I think you missed the bathos. And the irony. And the sarcasm. But hey ho.

[Lord Kangana]

Exactly - as someone said "We've got all this kit lying around- we may as well use it."

if that's the basic argument - that it basically costs nowt to be worried about and the stuff is there to be used - then I regularly do funerals for ace people who have lived ace lives and done ace things... I await the legislation that enables me to call upon the services of our armed forces and policemen who are sat about just waiting for someone to give them summat to do!

If I'm running late for work, and they've nowt on, can I just call 999 and get an ambulance or a police escort under your new rules?

[thebish]

I can see a case for Blair, three-term, Clause 4-scrapping, Good Friday Agreement-securing Prime Minister to have a St Paul's funeral.

I don't think there would be as many people strongly in favour of it as there were for Thatcher. I also think Blair's war, not one that involved British territory or the self determiantion of British citizens, is not likely to count in the 'plus' column when thinking about military honours, partly because of the way people feel his was dishonest in the lead-up to Iraq.

Is any of this incoherent?

no - but if I am honest, to me, it really just sounds like partisanship-dressed-as-lamb!

I would be perfectly relaxed about Blair having some kind of ceremonial funeral. What is partisan about that?

maybe I'm wrong - but I thought you once wrote that one felt right and the other didn't feel right and offered a reason why one should be and the other not? the thin distinction that you offered was the bit that seemed like dressing for partisanship - to me, anyway!

[thebish]

Exactly - as someone said "We've got all this kit lying around- we may as well use it."

if that's the basic argument - that it basically costs nowt to be worried about and the stuff is there to be used - then I regularly do funerals for ace people who have lived ace lives and done ace things... I await the legislation that enables me to call upon the services of our armed forces and policemen who are sat about just waiting for someone to give them summat to do!

If I'm running late for work, and they've nowt on, can I just call 999 and get an ambulance or a police escort under your new rules?

yep - if there's a car free and they've nowt on - should be fine!

[Lord Kangana]

Gets my vote. And its already paid for anyway. Win-win.

[mummywhycantieatcrayons]

I can see a case for Blair, three-term, Clause 4-scrapping, Good Friday Agreement-securing Prime Minister to have a St Paul's funeral.

I don't think there would be as many people strongly in favour of it as there were for Thatcher. I also think Blair's war, not one that involved British territory or the self determiantion of British citizens, is not likely to count in the 'plus' column when thinking about military honours, partly because of the way people feel his was dishonest in the lead-up to Iraq.

Is any of this incoherent?

no - but if I am honest, to me, it really just sounds like partisanship-dressed-as-lamb!

I would be perfectly relaxed about Blair having some kind of ceremonial funeral. What is partisan about that?

maybe I'm wrong - but I thought you once wrote that one felt right and the other didn't feel right and offered a reason why one should be and the other not? the thin distinction that you offered was the bit that seemed like dressing for partisanship - to me, anyway!

II have never argued that Blair shouldn't - just that his case *feels* less strong to me. Perhaps you're right and there is a partisan element that is acting on my subconscious. I'd be happy for Blair to have a ceremonial funeral (when the time comes!), just to clarify. Part of my argument was about what other people might feel, given that I am not yet directly consulted ont hese things.

[thebish]

II have never argued that Blair shouldn't - just that his case *feels* less strong to me. Perhaps you're right and there is a partisan element that is acting on my subconscious. I'd be happy for Blair to have a ceremonial funeral (when the time comes!), just to clarify. Part of my argument was about what other people might feel, given that I am not yet directly consulted ont hese things.

in the case of a Prime Minister - particularly nowadays - I think it is very difficult for anyone (so it's not just you!) to argue anything other than ALL or NONE without sounding partisan - especially if the one you pick out for special treatment happens to have been leader of the party you have most sympathy with... that's all!

[mummywhycantieatcrayons]

II have never argued that Blair shouldn't - just that his case *feels* less strong to me. Perhaps you're right and there is a partisan element that is acting on my subconscious. I'd be happy for Blair to have a ceremonial funeral (when the time comes!), just to clarify. Part of my argument was about what other people might feel, given that I am not yet directly consulted ont hese things.

in the case of a Prime Minister - particularly nowadays - I think it is very difficult for anyone (so it's not just you!) to argue anything other than ALL or NONE without sounding partisan - especially if the one you pick out for special treatment happens to have been leader of the party you have most sympathy with... that's all!

I disagree - I think some stand out. The more I think about this question (and, say, compare Blair to Major), the more Blair's case appeals to me.

[Worthy4England]

Wonder how much it cost to recall Parliament for the day to discuss what a tw@t she was? Add it to the bill...

[thebish]

Wonder how much it cost to recall Parliament for the day to discuss what a tw@t she was? Add it to the bill...

given that MPs could claim up to £3750 each for expenses, it's likely to have cost a pretty penny.... they were allowed to fly back from holiday - attend the commons - stay in a hotel overnight and then fly back on holiday....

When Parliament was recalled after the summer riots in August 2011, extra costs also included £32,228.56 for extra Hansard staff to record the debates, £5,000 in overtime for Met Police and £6,039 for tour guides.

interestingly, in the last five years Thatcher had herself claimed about £500,000 in expenses for "public duties"...

[Lost Leopard Spot]

Some of which was probably for her own funeral, probably tax deductable if ordered prior to death.

[Harry Genshaw]

Some of which was probably for her own funeral, probably tax deductable if ordered prior to death.

She enjoyed her final days in a hotel that, according to Panorama, paid no corporation tax for the last 17 years. She must have been well proud

[Hoboh]

Blair should be incarcerated within prison grounds after a Fred West style funeral!

On 1 January, 1995, Fred West hanged himself while on remand in his cell at Winson Green Prison, Birmingham. His funeral was held in Coventry on 29 March, 1995. West was cremated with only three people present.