A case for Defence (is it really all Zats Fault?)

[CrazyHorse]

are you suggesting our apparent toothlessness is all in our heads? - that in fact we DO have teeth??

No. Just that the perception that when we are 1-0 up it looks like the other side will always score a late equaliser, but we never look like doing so, is a standard feeling for supporters everywhere I reckon.

isn't it sometimes true though? taking your psychological theory away - did you actually think we looked like scoring a late equaliser on saturday - but psychology was blinding us to the chances we squandered?

I sat there thinking we could've played 'til Easter and we'd not've scored.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

if i imagined myself as QPR on saturday - no I wouldn't have been hiding behind the sofa waiting for the inevitable equaliser!

I'd've been more worried after Hall came on.

[TANGODANCER]

Tim Ream's apparently injured now.

[Harry Genshaw]

6 pages and yet the answer is 'yes', isn't it?

[adamworthy2002]

Another mistake from Knight tonight

[Andy Waller]

Every player drops a clanger now and then but it seems to be every other game with Knight.

He doesn't, to me, be A) Looking to work on his game and B) particularly arsed about it...


We're

[ChrisC]

Every player drops a clanger now and then but it seems to be every other game with Knight.

He doesn't, to me, be A) Looking to work on his game and B) particularly arsed about it...


We're

O2 Arenered?

[Bruce Rioja]

Every player drops a clanger now and then but it seems to be every other game with Knight.

He doesn't, to me, be A) Looking to work on his game and B) particularly arsed about it...


We're

O2 Arenered?

A monstrous carbuncle on the landing path to Heathrow?

[Andy Waller]

Every player drops a clanger now and then but it seems to be every other game with Knight.

He doesn't, to me, be A) Looking to work on his game and B) particularly arsed about it...


We're

O2 Arenered?

A monstrous carbuncle on the landing path to Heathrow?

Domed..

[boltonboris]

That's probably 5 goals conceded that Knight is directly responsible for. Which is only one less than we've scored. He's prolific.

[plymouth wanderer]

Not only is knight a shit defender but he also gives up possession way to easily lumping it forward at every fvcking opportunity

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Not only is knight a shit defender but he also gives up possession way to easily lumping it forward at every fvcking opportunity

More often than not, that is as a result of the midfielders not wanting it. Some defenders admittedly think they're Hierro and can ping 50-yard balls onto team-mates' toes, but most are happy to give the ball to a creative type in front of them.

Part of our problem is that the central midfielders - all of them - haven't wanted the ball enough, which means that it ends up with our centre-backs trying to bypass them, which very frequently tuns over possession to the opposition.

Whether it's Medo, Jay, Ream, Andrews or whoever, our central (as opposed to attacking) midfielders haven't shown enough consistent desire to request and recycle the ball. This system demands it; you can have the best front four in the world but if you aren't accurately getting the ball to them you won't win many matches.

Not to bang on about DF's last team but just as important to their system as any Zaha and Murray is Jedinak, who topped the pass list at Stoke on Saturday, completing 49 of 60 attempted passes from around the full width of the pitch. All bar 6 of them were short, and only 11 went backwards. I don't know what our lads' figures have been like but for all their promise and potential, I don't get the impression any of them want to get on the ball and make things happen, even if that thing is simply passing it diagonally forward 10 yards to a Moritz/Eagles/Hall/CYL-type player.

[plymouth wanderer]

[quote="Dave Sutton's barnet"][quote="plymouth wanderer"]Not only is knight a shit defender but he also gives up possession way to easily lumping it forward at every fvcking opportunity[/quote]More often than not, that is as a result of the midfielders not wanting it. Some defenders admittedly think they're Hierro and can ping 50-yard balls onto team-mates' toes, but most are happy to give the ball to a creative type in front of them.

Part of our problem is that the central midfielders - all of them - haven't wanted the ball enough, which means that it ends up with our centre-backs trying to bypass them, which very frequently tuns over possession to the opposition.

Whether it's Medo, Jay, Ream, Andrews or whoever, our central (as opposed to attacking) midfielders haven't shown enough consistent desire to request and recycle the ball. This system demands it; you can have the best front four in the world but if you aren't accurately getting the ball to them you won't win many matches.

Not to bang on about DF's last team but just as important to their system as any Zaha and Murray is Jedinak, who topped the pass list at Stoke on Saturday, completing 49 of 60 attempted passes from around the full width of the pitch. All bar 6 of them were short, and only 11 went backwards. I don't know what our lads' figures have been like but for all their promise and potential, I don't get the impression any of them want to get on the ball and make things happen, even if that thing is simply passing it diagonally forward 10 yards to a Moritz/Eagles/Hall/CYL-type player.[/quote]


True dat, but not on every occasion He has been doing it for years. I thought sparky was the best player for that, Dropping deep to pick up the ball and turn to pass it (simple)

Shame he's injured

[Armchair Wanderer]

Against QPR I noticed Tierney yell at Jay at least once to look as if he might like the ball. That's another route out of defence but if we're narrow instead of having overlapping fullbacks/wingers you have to involve the central midfielders more.

Apart from almost single-handedly causing the goal I thought Clint Hill had a good game for QPR... his head was on most things and he was not afraid to yell at players who might have been out of position.

Captainship-wise I'd rather give it to someone who's going to be solid defensively and use the ball wisely / yell at people if they're hiding. It's not good enough to say there was no-one available when you're getting paid how much a week.

[plymouth wanderer]

Against QPR I noticed Tierney yell at Jay at least once to look as if he might like the ball. That's another route out of defence but if we're narrow instead of having overlapping fullbacks/wingers you have to involve the central midfielders more.

Apart from almost single-handedly causing the goal I thought Clint Hill had a good game for QPR... his head was on most things and he was not afraid to yell at players who might have been out of position.

Captainship-wise I'd rather give it to someone who's going to be solid defensively and use the ball wisely / yell at people if they're hiding. It's not good enough to say there was no-one available when you're getting paid how much a week.

I know Dougie's been saying he wanted to play through the midfield more

[Hoboh]

Get Scholes out of retirement!!!

[Norpig]

I still say even after the last couple of mistakes by Zat defence does not begin when the ball comes into our box. It is easy to pick on one player for all our ills. Yes he has not been great over the last couple of game especially, neither have any of the other defenders. i though Spearing had his worst game against QPR he offered no protection to the back four or going forward, but he is a player who can do no wrong. Zat makes one mistake and the crowd is on his back no wonder he makes mistakes. I think we have to face the reality that he is the only player in the back four that is not injury prone, therefore is going to be a constant all season. What we need to do is give support around him. If we splurge all our money on Dawson and he is not as good as he was last time what happens then? Dawson could come in and make a few mistakes and everybody will still be blaming this years scapegoat!!

[Hoboh]

I still say even after the last couple of mistakes by Zat defence does not begin when the ball comes into our box. It is easy to pick on one player for all our ills. Yes he has not been great over the last couple of game especially, neither have any of the other defenders. i though Spearing had his worst game against QPR he offered no protection to the back four or going forward, but he is a player who can do no wrong. Zat makes one mistake and the crowd is on his back no wonder he makes mistakes. I think we have to face the reality that he is the only player in the back four that is not injury prone, therefore is going to be a constant all season. What we need to do is give support around him. If we splurge all our money on Dawson and he is not as good as he was last time what happens then? Dawson could come in and make a few mistakes and everybody will still be blaming this years scapegoat!!

His one mistake usually ruins someones weekend, costs the team points and then the stupid tosser comes out with bullshit about how ace everything will soon be!
Frankly I don't give a shit for the feelings of a big bloke like him who makes cinderella look butch! Captain, aye, SS TITANIC!!!

[BL3]

I thought that Dougie said he was going to going to teach the players how to 'manage' the game when we don't have the ball, because defending doesn't start with the back four? Is he planning to do that any time soon?

[Prufrock]

I think the prosecution rests.

He's wank.

It's not all his fault, but he's claimed more than his fair share.

I get DSB's point about the midfield, but he bashes it over their head when they do show. He also rolls it into midfield when they don't. He's useless.