Freedman out!

[jaffka]

Point is, he's staying. There's no taste from ED & PG to be rid ... he'll be here close season, have the role of getting rid of Knight, Eagles & probably Lee. Also of signing next year's new ones (Dann's & the Juke hopefully).

He will only be got rid of if we have yet another poor start. I suppose a question is if he remains mediocre (at best) whether he'll be let stay and just not have his contract not renewed.

No renewal of contract is my guess.

Apart from the odd flash in the pan, I cannot see anything other than mediocrity whilst he is here.

[BWFC_Insane]

I have a feeling Freedman will be here next season. He should have been sacked after 10 games of the season and certainly should have gone a few games ago when relegation was a real possibility but because he wasn't, it makes me wonder what will have to happen for him to be sacked. I don't see it happening before the start of next season, anyway. Keeping him will continue the downward spiral but that's what I expect. I hate supporting a club which accepts mediocrity.

Yeah I really hate it when clubs don't do as well as they once did. I don't think it should be allowed personally. Every club should be at the top of the league all the time.....

Failure is an inevitable part of football but pathetically rolling over and accepting it shouldn't be.

But then you think Freedman will be better Allardyce, so what do I know? Not as much as you, that's certain...

It isn't anything to do with "rolling over and accepting it". What do you want? They've spent money on players, seen turnover halved upon relegation and it further reduce still, seen losses go up, players that cost considerable money go for nothing...and all that across a number of managers and a period of time.

We're at a point now where seemingly Eddie Davies isn't going to throw money at anything. Changing manager is certainly far from a guarantee of anything. But it does cost money. Eddie has put a lot of his own money into the football club. IF he isn't prepared to pay for a managerial change and all that comes with it, then it is his choice. That isn't rolling over and accepting anything it is simply the financial reality.

But we've had plenty of times worse than this as fans before and we'll have them again. It is what supporting a club entails. You aren't going to be flying high all the time there is an ebb and flow to it and we're experiencing that now.

When people talk ambition what they really mean is money. This club has shown plenty of ambition over the past 15 years. Eddie D might well ask, and what have we got to show for it? But sadly that is an inevitable. When we were promoted we went up alongside Blackburn and Fulham. Three clubs who all beat the odds to stay in the top flight far longer than anyone expected upon promotion. We'll all most likely be in the same division next year...

Even if you were right with all that, which you aren't, it still has nothing to do with keeping Freedman in a job he clearly isn't capable of doing. Changing a manager is expensive, yes, but the compensation they'd receive for being sacked is only money that we're going to pay Freedman and his staff in wages anyway. If we promoted Phillips or Lee to manager position until the end of the season, you'd be looking at spending an additional couple of thousand a week or something like that. For a big business like Bolton, that's peanuts. If you want to look at the financial situation, the higher we finish, the more money we receive from the league and if we finish the season on a high, attendances will be up and season tickets for next year will be up. There's an argument that sacking Freedman would be expensive but there's also an argument that sacking Freedman and his useless staff could be financially beneficial too.

But all that is irrelevant to the discussion about Freedman. It's entirely baseless and a poor argument. We're a club that spent £1.5m on a single player in the summer, £500k on an unproven young player, signed a free transfer on big wages and are paying a percentage of the wages of several other players, yet you act like we're penny pinching. We clearly aren't. Yeah, some overpaid players are being shipped out but the way you bang on, you'd think the club toilets had yesterdays newpaper on a roll.

He's a failure of a manager, well out of his depth. Keeping him will only hurt the club in short and long term, both in results and financially. Bury your head in the sand if you want to, but it doesn't change the facts.

You have a very strange definition of fact. Fact is Eddie Davies has chosen to keep Freedman so far. The man who writes the cheques here can do whatever he wants until someone relieves him of that job by buying the club.

That is a fact. You either support the club through thick and thin or you don't!

[SmokinFrazier]

Yeah I really hate it when clubs don't do as well as they once did. I don't think it should be allowed personally. Every club should be at the top of the league all the time.....

Failure is an inevitable part of football but pathetically rolling over and accepting it shouldn't be.

But then you think Freedman will be better Allardyce, so what do I know? Not as much as you, that's certain...

It isn't anything to do with "rolling over and accepting it". What do you want? They've spent money on players, seen turnover halved upon relegation and it further reduce still, seen losses go up, players that cost considerable money go for nothing...and all that across a number of managers and a period of time.

We're at a point now where seemingly Eddie Davies isn't going to throw money at anything. Changing manager is certainly far from a guarantee of anything. But it does cost money. Eddie has put a lot of his own money into the football club. IF he isn't prepared to pay for a managerial change and all that comes with it, then it is his choice. That isn't rolling over and accepting anything it is simply the financial reality.

But we've had plenty of times worse than this as fans before and we'll have them again. It is what supporting a club entails. You aren't going to be flying high all the time there is an ebb and flow to it and we're experiencing that now.

When people talk ambition what they really mean is money. This club has shown plenty of ambition over the past 15 years. Eddie D might well ask, and what have we got to show for it? But sadly that is an inevitable. When we were promoted we went up alongside Blackburn and Fulham. Three clubs who all beat the odds to stay in the top flight far longer than anyone expected upon promotion. We'll all most likely be in the same division next year...

Even if you were right with all that, which you aren't, it still has nothing to do with keeping Freedman in a job he clearly isn't capable of doing. Changing a manager is expensive, yes, but the compensation they'd receive for being sacked is only money that we're going to pay Freedman and his staff in wages anyway. If we promoted Phillips or Lee to manager position until the end of the season, you'd be looking at spending an additional couple of thousand a week or something like that. For a big business like Bolton, that's peanuts. If you want to look at the financial situation, the higher we finish, the more money we receive from the league and if we finish the season on a high, attendances will be up and season tickets for next year will be up. There's an argument that sacking Freedman would be expensive but there's also an argument that sacking Freedman and his useless staff could be financially beneficial too.

But all that is irrelevant to the discussion about Freedman. It's entirely baseless and a poor argument. We're a club that spent £1.5m on a single player in the summer, £500k on an unproven young player, signed a free transfer on big wages and are paying a percentage of the wages of several other players, yet you act like we're penny pinching. We clearly aren't. Yeah, some overpaid players are being shipped out but the way you bang on, you'd think the club toilets had yesterdays newpaper on a roll.

He's a failure of a manager, well out of his depth. Keeping him will only hurt the club in short and long term, both in results and financially. Bury your head in the sand if you want to, but it doesn't change the facts.

You have a very strange definition of fact. Fact is Eddie Davies has chosen to keep Freedman so far. The man who writes the cheques here can do whatever he wants until someone relieves him of that job by buying the club.

That is a fact. You either support the club through thick and thin or you don't!

I'll support the club, just not the manager because the best thing for the club is to sack the manager.

Imagine what someone like Steve McClaren could have done with us if he'd come in 25 games ago when Freedman could have easily been sacked. What would have decision have done for our finances?

[Gravedigger]

Looking really not too far ahead and into next term. The loanees will have returned to their parent clubs, our loanees will come back to the Reebok and the cash balance will hardly have moved. The underperforming overly paid players will either move on or keep their heads down and look forward to another season of stealing their wages. We will be in the same predicament as now and still be rumbling along at the lower echelons of the table. It isn't going to get any better and will be a season just like this one. There's no excitement or willingness left now. AT one time we were giant killers, now we are the minnows trying to dodge the sharks. Hopefully Eddie will go shit or bust and sub us a team building amount or we truly will be domed.

[thebish]

Imagine what someone like Steve McClaren could have done with us if he'd come in 25 games ago...

who the feck knows what would have happened??

[BWFC_Insane]

Imagine what someone like Steve McClaren could have done with us if he'd come in 25 games ago...

who the feck knows what would have happened??

Yep and McClaren is the latest in a long line of 'look what we could have won's......'

Billy Davies was flavour of the month, not so much now. Dyche, McCarthy, Ince the list goes on....

I like McClaren and think he's a good manager and someone I wouldn't have minded when we sacked Megson and then Coyle. But the fact remains that to do anything in that regard, requires spending some money. The club can't generate that money unless something drastic has happened and would therefore require Eddie dipping into his pockets for some more spare change yet again......

[boltonboris]

I'm confused.. Are you excusing his disgraceful performance as our manager because the owner has held back on spending?

Or is this just the latest slant?

[officer_dibble]

He's had a tough job, granted. But he's not made a good job of it either.

[BWFC_Insane]

I'm confused.. Are you excusing his disgraceful performance as our manager because the owner has held back on spending?

Or is this just the latest slant?

Why does every single post in this section have to be a clear cut defence or attack on the manager? I wasn't saying anything other than Eddie Davies has over the years spent a lot of money sacking managers, hiring managers, changing backroom setups, signing players. He's now being accused of lacking ambition for not as it seems, plunging through the same cycle again.

He'd have to pay for it. And at the minute it doesn't seem like he will.

There is an assumption that changing the manager would make everything better. But it hasn't in the past and I think it would be a fair question for Eddie to ask "what have I got to show for all the 'ambition' (read money spent) I've shown previously?".

[Lord Kangana]

So what you're saying is we (and more importantly uncle Ted) would have just been better off sticking with Owen Coyle. I'm glad we completed the logic circle eventually.

[BWFC_Insane]

So what you're saying is we (and more importantly uncle Ted) would have just been better off sticking with Owen Coyle. I'm glad we completed the logic circle eventually.

No. We'd have been better off sticking with Sammy Lee and seeing what he could actually do in the longer term. If you want to view it like that. Would have saved a hell of a lot of moolah.....

[Lord Kangana]

So yes then.

[BWFC_Insane]

So yes then.

The question of where to get off the train, once you're on it, is a very different one to that of whether to get on the train in the first place. So no then.

[jaffka]

I'm confused.. Are you excusing his disgraceful performance as our manager because the owner has held back on spending?

Or is this just the latest slant?

Why does every single post in this section have to be a clear cut defence or attack on the manager? I wasn't saying anything other than Eddie Davies has over the years spent a lot of money sacking managers, hiring managers, changing backroom setups, signing players. He's now being accused of lacking ambition for not as it seems, plunging through the same cycle again.

He'd have to pay for it. And at the minute it doesn't seem like he will.

There is an assumption that changing the manager would make everything better. But it hasn't in the past and I think it would be a fair question for Eddie to ask "what have I got to show for all the 'ambition' (read money spent) I've shown previously?".

There is only you, who comes out with bollox attempting to defend a manager for completely underachieving this season.
Trying to put any feckin bullshit slant on the reason why we have overall been crap.

People, quite rightly so, challenge the crap that you come out with.

[Lord Kangana]

So yes then.

The question of where to get off the train, once you're on it, is a very different one to that of whether to get on the train in the first place. So no then.

I think your left rudder is broken.

[Worthy4England]

There is an assumption that changing the manager would make everything better. But it hasn't in the past and I think it would be a fair question for Eddie to ask "what have I got to show for all the 'ambition' (read money spent) I've shown previously?".

Oh yes it has.

Appointing Allardyce, Rioch, Greaves etc. all made it better.

But of course there's no guarantee that it will, unless you appoint the right one. Which at this point in time Freedman clearly isn't.

[BWFC_Insane]

There is an assumption that changing the manager would make everything better. But it hasn't in the past and I think it would be a fair question for Eddie to ask "what have I got to show for all the 'ambition' (read money spent) I've shown previously?".

Oh yes it has.

Appointing Allardyce, Rioch, Greaves etc. all made it better.

But of course there's no guarantee that it will, unless you appoint the right one. Which at this point in time Freedman clearly isn't.

I meant in the time since Eddie Davies has been writing the cheques.

Hoping to find the next Rioch or Allardyce feels to me like searching for a needle in a haystack. And possibly the thirst for that has clouded decisions at Bolton since Allardyce left. Instead of saying that we needed to re-focus the club we've been searching for another man to do exactly what Allardyce did and lead from the front in a way few can.

I mean it is like at Man Utd, they'll never find another Ferguson, they might be better off looking for something different entirely....

And I agree with what you're saying. I think the danger is that we are obsessed with the "right one" when the reality is most clubs are making do with someone less than ideal through necessity or simply lack of options. I think/fear that is where we're at. And expecting to unearth a miracle man because we managed it a 14 years ago is possibly only going to lead to further frustration.

[Hoboh]

There is an assumption that changing the manager would make everything better. But it hasn't in the past and I think it would be a fair question for Eddie to ask "what have I got to show for all the 'ambition' (read money spent) I've shown previously?".

Oh yes it has.

Appointing Allardyce, Rioch, Greaves etc. all made it better.

But of course there's no guarantee that it will, unless you appoint the right one. Which at this point in time Freedman clearly isn't.

I meant in the time since Eddie Davies has been writing the cheques.

Hoping to find the next Rioch or Allardyce feels to me like searching for a needle in a haystack. And possibly the thirst for that has clouded decisions at Bolton since Allardyce left. Instead of saying that we needed to re-focus the club we've been searching for another man to do exactly what Allardyce did and lead from the front in a way few can.

I mean it is like at Man Utd, they'll never find another Ferguson, they might be better off looking for something different entirely....

And I agree with what you're saying. I think the danger is that we are obsessed with the "right one" when the reality is most clubs are making do with someone less than ideal through necessity or simply lack of options. I think/fear that is where we're at. And expecting to unearth a miracle man because we managed it a 14 years ago is possibly only going to lead to further frustration.

Someone competent would do not Jesus!
We are talking wining promotion from the chumpionship not having a manager capable of wining the champions league or the premeirship, something I doubt even the most tin foil hatted fan we had could expect!

[BWFC_Insane]

There is an assumption that changing the manager would make everything better. But it hasn't in the past and I think it would be a fair question for Eddie to ask "what have I got to show for all the 'ambition' (read money spent) I've shown previously?".

Oh yes it has.

Appointing Allardyce, Rioch, Greaves etc. all made it better.

But of course there's no guarantee that it will, unless you appoint the right one. Which at this point in time Freedman clearly isn't.

I meant in the time since Eddie Davies has been writing the cheques.

Hoping to find the next Rioch or Allardyce feels to me like searching for a needle in a haystack. And possibly the thirst for that has clouded decisions at Bolton since Allardyce left. Instead of saying that we needed to re-focus the club we've been searching for another man to do exactly what Allardyce did and lead from the front in a way few can.

I mean it is like at Man Utd, they'll never find another Ferguson, they might be better off looking for something different entirely....

And I agree with what you're saying. I think the danger is that we are obsessed with the "right one" when the reality is most clubs are making do with someone less than ideal through necessity or simply lack of options. I think/fear that is where we're at. And expecting to unearth a miracle man because we managed it a 14 years ago is possibly only going to lead to further frustration.

Someone competent would do not Jesus!
We are talking wining promotion from the chumpionship not having a manager capable of wining the champions league or the premeirship, something I doubt even the most tin foil hatted fan we had could expect!

A manager as good as Allardyce only just got us promoted via the playoffs during our third season in this division.

Given the increased financial gap and the drop off next season in our income, we will have the budget of a mid table championship side, IF Eddie persists in trying to match up with the FFP rules. Promotion will be well beyond mere "competence".

[palexjones]

There is an assumption that changing the manager would make everything better. But it hasn't in the past and I think it would be a fair question for Eddie to ask "what have I got to show for all the 'ambition' (read money spent) I've shown previously?".

Oh yes it has.

Appointing Allardyce, Rioch, Greaves etc. all made it better.

But of course there's no guarantee that it will, unless you appoint the right one. Which at this point in time Freedman clearly isn't.

I meant in the time since Eddie Davies has been writing the cheques.

Hoping to find the next Rioch or Allardyce feels to me like searching for a needle in a haystack. And possibly the thirst for that has clouded decisions at Bolton since Allardyce left. Instead of saying that we needed to re-focus the club we've been searching for another man to do exactly what Allardyce did and lead from the front in a way few can.

I mean it is like at Man Utd, they'll never find another Ferguson, they might be better off looking for something different entirely....

And I agree with what you're saying. I think the danger is that we are obsessed with the "right one" when the reality is most clubs are making do with someone less than ideal through necessity or simply lack of options. I think/fear that is where we're at. And expecting to unearth a miracle man because we managed it a 14 years ago is possibly only going to lead to further frustration.

Someone competent would do not Jesus!
We are talking wining promotion from the chumpionship not having a manager capable of wining the champions league or the premeirship, something I doubt even the most tin foil hatted fan we had could expect!

A manager as good as Allardyce only just got us promoted via the playoffs during our third season in this division.

Given the increased financial gap and the drop off next season in our income, we will have the budget of a mid table championship side, IF Eddie persists in trying to match up with the FFP rules. Promotion will be well beyond mere "competence".

Burnley...............