Malaysia Airlines MH370

[Worthy4England]

without any 'hard' evidence, it really answers nothing. They should have waited but the previous cock ups have made them too hasty to release information IMO.

Really? You don't think they'd feel the need to have gone beyond all reasonable doubt before making such an announcement to the bereaved families and the world in general?

You've got to believe they're almost 100% certain, that it's wreckage from the flight...

[Little Green Man]

without any 'hard' evidence, it really answers nothing. They should have waited but the previous cock ups have made them too hasty to release information IMO.

Really? You don't think they'd feel the need to have gone beyond all reasonable doubt before making such an announcement to the bereaved families and the world in general?

Indeed. Which is likely to be the one of the reasons why this information has taken so long to come out.

Inmarsat will have had access to the 'ping' data for a while. What they may not have had is the necessary software to process that particular dataset. In that case a team of highly technical software engineers will have had to design, develop and then test it. Then, as the answer that it produced was so critical to the families and the search teams they will have check it and the algorithms again and again. Then it was passed it to the AAIB for them to re-check the methodology and result. They may have released their initial findings to the search teams and that may be why they have concentrated their search on the southern Indian Ocean. However I doubt they would have announced their findings to the family and the world without being sure beyond reasonable doubt.

Of course they've all wasted their time because it's in Somalia.

[Worthy4England]

If that's where it downed, roughly in the search area that most folks are now pointing towards with the debris in it, I'm really confused as to where it thought it was going and why? If the pilots wanted to crash it, they could've probably done it much quicker, than by flying off until it ran out of fuel. It would seem like a strange place for a terrorist to bring the thing down - bugger all publicity and took a long time to be found. Just all seems a bit bizarre...

[Athers]

I'm one who is guessing that it's flown on autopilot for all that way after whatever's gone on up there, but it does seem a strong [or not a] coincidence that it's gone in the exact opposite direction to Beijing and ended up in the best place to 'hide' a plane if you were to try.

[Montreal Wanderer]

I'm one who is guessing that it's flown on autopilot for all that way after whatever's gone on up there, but it does seem a strong [or not a] coincidence that it's gone in the exact opposite direction to Beijing and ended up in the best place to 'hide' a plane if you were to try.

I would guess autopilot for the last six hours too, although the dramatic change of direction would suggest a hijack attempt and the long silence a sudden depressurization. .

[bobo the clown]

It has to be something staggeringly quick to have NO radio contact of any kind ... OR a 3rd party intervention. Also, the total lack of communication from passengers wirh lappy's, tablets, mobiles fits the sudden loss of pressure. They can't have sat for 6 hours with no attempt to contact even if there baddies guarding them.

... and then an autopilot thing till the fuel ran out.

[Little Green Man]

They can't have sat for 6 hours with no attempt to contact even if there baddies guarding them.

They may have tried but without a signal they'd have been wasting their time. There won't be a lot of digital phone masts in the Indian Ocean.

I'd have thought the only option would have been a satellite phone.

[boltonboris]

But what about the families who said the phones of the 'deceased' were ringing out?

[Athers]

A quick google suggests it is possible to get GPS to work sometimes on planes but it's unlikely as you're in a tin can.

[a1]

my conspiracy theory is-

its in iran , or crashed post hijack (..in the indian ocean possibly) when the chinese passengers et al did a flight 93.

is my bet still 'on' ?

[Athers]

I doubt the flight 93 theory as it flew until it run out of fuel. If it was deliberately flown south like that whoever was piloting could have shut the secure doors and not come out.

Tbf I was wondering how long would it take for passengers, if awake, to realise they were flying in the wrong direction - it was a night flight so all they'd have to go on were those left turns. If they weren't noticed the flight would have been nearing its final position by the time the Sun came up and you could see it was over Ocean rather than China. I suppose there are enough passengers for a few of them to be thinking about those turns. The crew would probably recognise something different to normal too.

[Gravedigger]

Rapid descent to 25,000 feet then power climb to 45,000 while altering course. Possible deliberate explosive decompression. Switch off all transponders manually. Asphyxiation of all onboard, (passengers have about 15 minutes oxygen, crew about 30 minutes) after autopilot set and onwards until out of fuel. They don't glide too well but impact would certainly create much smaller pieces unless it was a controlled ditching. The finding of large chunks of debris is a mystery so it's a wait and see game. The one agency saying nowt is Boeing itself and I can't for the life of me believe that no defence systems in any of the affected countries saw an unlabelled paint on their radar screens and did nothing. The pings picked up by INMARSAT in London are giving accurate positional information but then the black box has to be found in up to 8,000 metres depth. Cabin crew have access to portable distress beacons plus there's an alleged tail mounted one, so it's a mystery why they didn't activate them. Better not put any money on a hijacking, it's going to be a wait and see game.

[Worthy4England]

I doubt the flight 93 theory as it flew until it run out of fuel. If it was deliberately flown south like that whoever was piloting could have shut the secure doors and not come out.

Tbf I was wondering how long would it take for passengers, if awake, to realise they were flying in the wrong direction - it was a night flight so all they'd have to go on were those left turns. If they weren't noticed the flight would have been nearing its final position by the time the Sun came up and you could see it was over Ocean rather than China. I suppose there are enough passengers for a few of them to be thinking about those turns. The crew would probably recognise something different to normal too.

I wouldn't have a Scooby, unless they had that map switched on, on the seat backs - which I assume they didn't as all the tracking was switched off. Not being sat there thinking about anything untowards going on, I wouldn't have assumed anything other than "all's ok" (unless it clearly wasn't because there were blokes with guns everywhere)

[Dujon]

[Gravedigger] I haven't read the information on the descent and climb data or the rate at which it occurred but a drop from, say, FL320 to FL250 and then a climb to FL450 must be significant. Unless there was a significant weather 'event' then it must be either a mechanical/electrical problem, with the flight crew trying to control the aircraft, or an incompetent exercise in changing the aircraft's flight plan. I suppose that the altered directions (using known co-ordinates - beacons and airports) might explain the turns made after the squawk and other IDs had been turned off. The final heading though could have been an error in entering the new flight plan. Pop them in with reversed co-ordinates (N S W E) where the way point is not a recognised beacon and the aircraft is going far from its intended.

Just a thought. I have no idea as to why, how or whatever happened on that flight any more than I have of 20+ metre lengths of debris floating around the place.

[Gravedigger]

I'm getting some info via the Professional Pilots Rumour Net, John. There are a number of experts and where the most accurate facts are coming out as we all know flight envelopes, radar and reporting procedures and lots of technical stuff coming from dozens of sources. As you may be aware there are absolutely no airways so far out and south west from Perth. The sudden plunge could have been a cockpit struggle, wind shear, massive equipment failure. I believe the initial cruise was at 36000, drop to 25000 and climb to 45000. The comms systems had to be turned off manually, for instance the sqwawk is press a button and two clicks to standby. This would be the same on the second transponder. After climb back to altitude someone was heard to utter a farewell and thankyou thing that wasn't r/t procedural then all comms gone apart from the pings to the satellite. I know the RAF and Fkeet Air Arm on occasion have had pilots who set the instrument FROM a way-point when it should have been TO that way-point, thus going on a reciprocal course so there's a possibility that the course selected to the south east may well have meant to be to the north west. Lots of guesswork going on and until the black box is found we'll never know.

This is the civilian side of Prune and takes a bit of reading, lol. The military side is a bit further down the home page.

http://www.pprune.org/rumours-news/5355 ... -lost.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Hoboh]

I'm getting some info via the Professional Pilots Rumour Net, John. There are a number of experts and where the most accurate facts are coming out as we all know flight envelopes, radar and reporting procedures and lots of technical stuff coming from dozens of sources. As you may be aware there are absolutely no airways so far out and south west from Perth. The sudden plunge could have been a cockpit struggle, wind shear, massive equipment failure. I believe the initial cruise was at 36000, drop to 25000 and climb to 45000. The comms systems had to be turned off manually, for instance the sqwawk is press a button and two clicks to standby. This would be the same on the second transponder. After climb back to altitude someone was heard to utter a farewell and thankyou thing that wasn't r/t procedural then all comms gone apart from the pings to the satellite. I know the RAF and Fkeet Air Arm on occasion have had pilots who set the instrument FROM a way-point when it should have been TO that way-point, thus going on a reciprocal course so there's a possibility that the course selected to the south east may well have meant to be to the north west. Lots of guesswork going on and until the black box is found we'll never know.

This is the civilian side of Prune and takes a bit of reading, lol. The military side is a bit further down the home page.

http://www.pprune.org/rumours-news/5355 ... -lost.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

A bit!!

To be honest it seems some of the 'Pro's' on there are as confused as us, some clever stuff tho'.

[Gravedigger]

True, Hoboh, some guesses for about 200 pages before the more expert comes through. Once the area was identified and all the hindsight merchants had buggered off the picture became clearer and still lots of guesswork, but getting more sensible posts. I just hope that at some stage the black boxes will be found but the cockpit voice recorder only records for 2 hours then is overwritten. I don't think they envisaged such a long after event flight. Must be a bugger for the families waiting for news. I only hope that Malaysia are taken to task for the misleading tripe they put out, and that Australia will keep their over the horizon radar, Jindalee, turned on overnight. Still lots to come. The link gives some idea of what can happen. I know it's the Daily Wail but in essence true.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... crash.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Hoboh]

True, Hoboh, some guesses for about 200 pages before the more expert comes through. Once the area was identified and all the hindsight merchants had buggered off the picture became clearer and still lots of guesswork, but getting more sensible posts. I just hope that at some stage the black boxes will be found but the cockpit voice recorder only records for 2 hours then is overwritten. I don't think they envisaged such a long after event flight. Must be a bugger for the families waiting for news. I only hope that Malaysia are taken to task for the misleading tripe they put out, and that Australia will keep their over the horizon radar, Jindalee, turned on overnight. Still lots to come. The link gives some idea of what can happen. I know it's the Daily Wail but in essence true.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... crash.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The difference I can see here and a major one to boot is this;

The flight was declared "renegade" when it entered Greek air space and failed to make radio contact. Two F-16 air force jets were scrambled to investigate

Someone, somewhere, picked up that Malaysian plane and just ignored it, in effect a serious breach of security, one that will never be admitted yet one that has helped cause so much anguish.

[Hoboh]

without any 'hard' evidence, it really answers nothing. They should have waited but the previous cock ups have made them too hasty to release information IMO.

Really? You don't think they'd feel the need to have gone beyond all reasonable doubt before making such an announcement to the bereaved families and the world in general?

You've got to believe they're almost 100% certain, that it's wreckage from the flight...

Ping!

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/m ... onsumption" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Thought they were far too quick off the mark to anounce anything like they have done.
How many plane wrecks have they detected so far?
Some people, whatever their intentions, are begining to look stupid, when they find actual wreckage then they can confirm it went down based on fact not theory.

[Lost Leopard Spot]

One thing is absolutely certain... despite the search, in "one of the remotest areas of the planet", it's certainly packed full of shit that's man made. Throws a bit more light on the bits that aren't remote... I'm amazed any seabird can land on ocean, what with the amount of utter shite we litter the fckin planet. Tree-huggers eh, maybe we should rename ourselves Pilchard-huggers