Today I'm angry about.....

[TANGODANCER]

Don't know how you'd go on back when Bolton used to shut for a fortnight.

[Bruce Rioja]

Don't know how you'd go on back when Bolton used to shut for a fortnight.

What a mixed bag that was. A fortnight off of school but the place was just a ghost town.

[TANGODANCER]

Don't know how you'd go on back when Bolton used to shut for a fortnight.

What a mixed bag that was. A fortnight off of school but the place was just a ghost town.

Aye, people still find it hard to believe now, but, last week in June and first in July (Bolton Wakes-Bolton Sleeps would have been more apt) the town was, as you say a ghost town with all the shops with blinds pulled down. I can remember coming back from second week in Blackpool and going to the Palais where Ray Ellington was guest starring that week. At the end of his first number he came to the front of the stage and said: "Where the hell you all been all week?"

[malcd1]

There are a lot of people who want to work at weekend especially those with children. It is an opportunity to earn extra money quite often at better rates.

If you don't like Sunday shopping then don't go. It is not for all but it is the only time for some people to do it.

[bobo the clown]

Don't know how you'd go on back when Bolton used to shut for a fortnight.

What a mixed bag that was. A fortnight off of school but the place was just a ghost town.

"Off of" ????

[Abdoulaye's Twin]

Where has this "need" to shop 27 hours a day, 9 days a week emerged from?

I say shut all shops on a sunday, just for the look of bemusement on peoples faces when they have to think of something else to do.

+1

I remember when I were a young lad and worked in retail. When the 6 hour trading on a Sunday thing came in, I was invited to sign something to say I wanted to work Sundays. When I asked what would happen if I didn't want to work Sundays, I was told I'd have no job. Suppose it's different now as you go into it knowing, but back then the goal posts were moved for retail workers.

My memories of working Sundays were that it was by far the worse day to work. Full of bored families that would rather be elsewhere, not spending money and trashing the shop. It was the busiest day of the week and one of the worst for turnover. The only other day of the year to work that was worse was Boxing Day. Every bored wanker in a 30 mile radius would come in and piss and moan about something or other. Getting out of retail and into an office was one of the best decisions I ever made!

[thebish]

I don't think 3 applies, and don't agree with 1. 2 is the only strong argument I hear against it, in which case restrict how long people can work on a Sunday, rather than how long shops can open.

should you - as in you - be made to work in your chosen profession on a sunday? Or do you - as in you - enjoy and value the expectation of having Sunday off?

Don't give them ideas!

People should have expectations as to certain time off, but I don't see why it has to be a Sunday.

the point (for me) has been the likelihood that for a lot of people it is the same day - thus making Sunday the day when family gatherings can happen and community events can be planned...

I get that the world is changing - fair do's - but I don't get why it is that it is obviously necessary for so many people to need to shop for groceries on a sunday such that supermarket staff be forced to work on sundays as if they were some kind of essential or emergency service!

[thebish]

There are a lot of people who want to work at weekend especially those with children. It is an opportunity to earn extra money quite often at better rates.

If you don't like Sunday shopping then don't go. It is not for all but it is the only time for some people to do it.

I simply don't believe that is true for enough people to warrant opening all the supermarkets all day sunday and making all the retail staff work sundays...

and - as I have made clear - my objections are not really about "me" and whether I want to shop on Sunday - so the answer to my objections is not for me not to shop on Sunday! I work Sundays anyway! i don't have a choice - but I don't see the need to take away that choice from retail staff.

[thebish]

as it happens - I am pretty sure I am on what will be the losing side of the argument - and before that much longer, Sunday will be like any other day... and i suspect our society/culture/community health will be all the poorer for it..

but that's progress for you!

[Worthy4England]

I think the notion that most folks work 5 days a week then have Saturday watching the footie and Sunday as some sort of "family day" without interference from any working obligations, has long since passed.

Many people work such long hours mid-week that their only options are Saturday/Sunday. Often work hits Saturday too - so that only leaves Sunday.

Tesco's (whilst you can't actually shop all day Sunday) will deliver your shopping most of it. 1000-1500 and 1800 to 2200, so why not just open the bloody shop. If folks want to shop then and retailers want to sell then, I think there has to be an adaptation. Tesco's aren't actually fighting for longer opening hours on a Sunday (but in part, that's because they have a lot of retail space that is small enough (below Superstore level), to allow them to cover Sunday's anyhow...

[Lord Kangana]

Can I just lob a grenade into the argument please?

Morals aside, during the Olympics, supermarkets were offered the chance to open longer on sundays. the overwhelming majority declined. Simple argument, the consensus is that the market is already saturated, and opening longer would simply increase costs without increasing turnover. Its a classic business mistake, so they're not all idiots, apparently.

[thebish]

it's not supermarkets that really want to open... the retiring CEO of sainsbury's said they didn't want to a couple of months ago...

[thebish]

Many people work such long hours mid-week that their only options are Saturday/Sunday.

i'm still not convinced that this is really true for enough people that we insist that supermarkets all have to open on sundays and their staff go into work...

[Worthy4England]

Can I just lob a grenade into the argument please?

Morals aside, during the Olympics, supermarkets were offered the chance to open longer on sundays. the overwhelming majority declined. Simple argument, the consensus is that the market is already saturated, and opening longer would simply increase costs without increasing turnover. Its a classic business mistake, so they're not all idiots, apparently.

That would be a simple argument, if of course it was that simple. Quite a number of them have a mixed estate - retail space to which the Sunday trading laws apply and retail space to which it doesn't. Tesco's are reasonably happy that the cost of opening on a Sunday on their Superstore space would cost money and might not have a discernible increase in Revenue, but that the slack in terms of market share is offset by it's Tesco Express and smaller retail spaces - so it already opens on a Sunday. Other retailers don't have that type of estate, so a more in favour of opening on a Sunday. Either way none of them are considering closing on a Sunday - they've just approached the problem differently. Asda and Morrisons are in favour, because their real estate portfolio is different than Tesco's. So I don't believe there's a consensus view at all.

There is more to it than the Supermarkets - places like B&Q don't have "small" retail footprint - they're pretty much all large superstores.

[Hoboh]

Many people work such long hours mid-week that their only options are Saturday/Sunday.

i'm still not convinced that this is really true for enough people that we insist that supermarkets all have to open on sundays and their staff go into work...

Staff work because that is the contract they are offered, if you are not contracted you don't have to work it unless you want overtime.
So they are not 'slaves'.

[bobo the clown]

People who work in the service &/or leisure industries are employed to help offer services to customers. They really shouldn't moan too much if that is at times which are when the majority are free.

I'm all for Sundays being a bit less in yer face than other days but people who complain that they are being 'forced' to work certain hours rarely are, more likely they are the hours that are available and, to be fair, if a Company rewards and develops people who offer more flexibility well ... there you go. So, a supermarket worker who avoids weekends shouldn't be too surprised if their colleague who does all they are asked gets the promotions, recognitions, the training etc., etc.

The 'cake and eat it' approach is unfair & unreasonable

[thebish]

Many people work such long hours mid-week that their only options are Saturday/Sunday.

i'm still not convinced that this is really true for enough people that we insist that supermarkets all have to open on sundays and their staff go into work...

Staff work because that is the contract they are offered, if you are not contracted you don't have to work it unless you want overtime.
So they are not 'slaves'.

yes - i understand that - but why should we insist that supermarkets have contracts that make their staff work on sundays - and not (say) lawyers or solicitors or bank staff or teachers or estate agents or any other kind of non-essential business that doesn't run on a sunday?

i simply don't believe that a truly significant number of people cannot organise their lives in such a way that supermarket shopping on a sunday is not necessary.

anyway hobes - I thought you were always on about immigrants eroding our culture and our British way of life - you don't seem to actually give a stuff!

[Worthy4England]

Many people work such long hours mid-week that their only options are Saturday/Sunday.

i'm still not convinced that this is really true for enough people that we insist that supermarkets all have to open on sundays and their staff go into work...

I'm not insisting, so I don't give a buggers whether you're convinced or not . I think the laws should relax to give them the choice. The measure would then be consumer demand - which would save your good self tossing and turning at night trying to figure out whether it exists or not. How much demand is there at 02:00 (I've been shopping at 02:00, it's not usually a problem with queuing), it would probably be better to be open on a Sunday and not at 02:00 on a Wednesday.

[thebish]

I'm all for Sundays being a bit less in yer face than other days

in what way "less in yer face" do you want it to be?

[bobo the clown]

I'm all for Sundays being a bit less in yer face than other days

in what way "less in yer face" do you want it to be?

In the way it's less "in yer face" than Saturdays ... yet not dead, like they used to be. If I go into Chester on a Sunday it's way, way less busy that a Saturday. Shops open later, close earlier, some don't open at all. It's free to park in some car parks. Roads less busy, streets & shops less crowded and less sense of it being a trial to be there.

The current balance isn't far off. I could want a little more of something, or a little less of something else, but that would be nit-picking.